|
Post by whitediamonds on Nov 4, 2018 9:18:37 GMT -6
Wait. Make your mind up. Do you think that innocents never get executed because muh DNA, or do you agree with Joe that the fact that innocents have been executed is "beyond dispute" and something "we all accept"? No DNA is just the ace to add to other evidence. With your no DP stance at all Bernard, how about the Synagogue shooter? There is no way I would ever want no DP, majority would say this killer needs execution not some 20-30 yrs later.
|
|
|
Post by whitediamonds on Nov 4, 2018 9:08:58 GMT -6
OJ, Casey Anthony, advanced technology, cameras, DNA. Not calculated it's an obvious. Facts: Advanced more sophisticated forensic. DNA only puts you at the scene. It rarely proves that you did it. As for me, I can't get away from how many people have been released from the row by the Innocence Project Unless the business of exonerating DR inmates is the first and only endeavor that humans have ever perfected, these folks can't possibly be batting a perfect score. Even if they are doing pretty well, they will sometimes exonerate the guilty, and fail to exonerate the innocent. And that means there are innocents who end up executed. It's a simple consequence of human imperfection. How can the Innocence Project find without today's technology who was truly innocent? No hard facts ,not to mention of course,no hard proof anyone who was innocent was executed.
|
|
|
Post by whitediamonds on Nov 4, 2018 8:58:31 GMT -6
OJ, Casey Anthony, advanced technology, cameras, DNA. Not calculated it's an obvious. Facts: Advanced more sophisticated forensic. DNA only puts you at the scene. It rarely proves that you did it. As for me, I can't get away from how many people have been released from the row by the Innocence Project and other like minded folk. Unless the business of exonerating DR inmates is the first and only endeavor that humans have ever perfected, these folks can't possibly be batting a perfect score. Even if they are doing pretty well, they will sometimes exonerate the guilty, and fail to exonerate the innocent. And that means there are innocents who end up executed. It's a simple consequence of human imperfection. Yeah, look at the dates they were sentenced to begin with. Your talking old school.
|
|
|
Post by whitediamonds on Nov 3, 2018 20:01:07 GMT -6
Odds of an innocent facing the DP are slim to none in today's age. How did you calculate those odds? OJ, Casey Anthony, advanced technology, cameras, DNA. Not calculated it's an obvious. Facts: Advanced more sophisticated forensic.
|
|
|
Post by whitediamonds on Nov 3, 2018 10:14:14 GMT -6
Bottom line. Far too many victims of murder. Top priority. Odds of an innocent facing the DP are slim to none in today's age.
|
|
|
Post by whitediamonds on Oct 31, 2018 17:12:02 GMT -6
Totally irrelevant Strawman arguments! Exposing hypocrisy is never irrelevant. That innocents have died in prison, whether by execution, old age, suicide or whatever, is beyond dispute. We all accept it. Why are we even having this argument? Exactly.
|
|
|
Post by whitediamonds on Oct 31, 2018 17:03:22 GMT -6
The show will crash & burn. That's what I imagine will happen, but I might be wrong. Tuesdays Halloween show had a bit higher ratings, which I expected personally. The old Halloween shows were great. Now it will go back down hill I believe.
|
|
|
Post by whitediamonds on Oct 19, 2018 14:16:03 GMT -6
The other extreme, no forgiveness or mercy for the pettiest sin being, just words spoken. Horrible what so called offended will go to, yet save murders. Many who watched "The Conners" Tuesday were the curious who wanted to know how they would kill her off on the show. I noticed that pos Sara Gilbert who threw her under the bus immediately, her name comes first. A goofy liberal. I will not watch that show. Yeah it will be interesting to see how the show fares. The show will crash & burn. Now it has gotten so crazy, even Snow White & Kleenex is under attack.
|
|
|
Post by whitediamonds on Oct 17, 2018 18:55:00 GMT -6
I believe this was in Iran where, as I understand it, a member of the victim's family can reprieve the condemned from the noose at any given time. In fact, I think the victims family can demand payment from the condemned as a form of retribution rather than execution. I don't normally think of fundamentalist theocracies like Iran as being ahead of us on the cultural importance of forgiveness and mercy. But there it is. Can't help thinking that, as Christianity has been on the wane, the West has forgotten how to forgive even the pettiest of sins. I mean, look what they did to Roseanne. Forgiveness & mercy for killers? The other extreme, no forgiveness or mercy for the pettiest sin being, just words spoken. Horrible what so called offended will go to, yet save murders. Many who watched "The Conners" Tuesday were the curious who wanted to know how they would kill her off on the show. I noticed that pos Sara Gilbert who threw her under the bus immediately, her name comes first. A goofy liberal. I will not watch that show.
|
|
|
Post by whitediamonds on Oct 17, 2018 18:44:42 GMT -6
What was the point of that? I believe this was in Iran where, as I understand it, a member of the victim's family can reprieve the condemned from the noose at any given time. In fact, I think the victims family can demand payment from the condemned as a form of retribution rather than execution. The victims family can demand $$ ?? Disgusting reason to save a killer from execution. Money talks. And how does this killer make money?
|
|
|
Post by whitediamonds on Oct 9, 2018 17:40:04 GMT -6
Have you seen how they leap to judgments of guilt? Yes, I have and particularly so with Brett Kavanaugh when there wasn't even a shred of credible evidence against him. Also, we continue to read about some poor dumb bas***d who after spending years behind bars for a crime he did not commit was eventually freed because his DNA did not match that of the actual perpetrator of the crime. And then I have come to distrust many of those involved in criminal prosecution because they often impress me as being psychopaths who are more concerned about getting a conviction than they are about the innocence or guilt of the defendant they are prosecuting. Bottom-line; I am rethinking my position on the death penalty because I fear the possibility of an innocent man or woman being executed. Those are all old decades ago, not how the system works for sometime now. There is so much proof now to get a guilty verdict. Look at the Casey Anthony case & OJ case. I still believe they are guilty as all get out, but walked.
|
|
|
Post by whitediamonds on Oct 8, 2018 19:42:56 GMT -6
it is now almost 42 years since the state of Utah guaranteed that gary gilmore will cause no more problems. nor since that time has gary gilmore cost the state of Utah a dime in wasted food, clothing, shelter and utilities. where else in "government" can you get that kind of efficiency? Capital punishment has never been about deterrence, since 95+ percent of murderers get paroled. Can't prove, it may be a deterrent for some to not murder to begin with, knowing they may face a DP sentence. I would bet it has stopped some.
|
|
|
Post by whitediamonds on Sept 25, 2018 16:55:29 GMT -6
You brought up the movie Death Wish in another post reply. I did not. You have me confused with someone else. Speak for yourself I had situations were I may have thought of killing someone, never did. I have always had a gun & know how to use it. That you haven't been motivated doesn't mean you never will be. You would do it for money. Anyone would, if the price was right. You would do it if you expected your victim would go on to kill someone, or had already done so. You would do it if someone was breaking into your home even if your life wasn't in danger. You would certainly be more likely to do it if it were legal. You cannot speak for all mankind. I don't have to. History, sociology, biology, psychology all buttress the irrefutable statement. As far as the DP, some who kill then kill themselves too. We need & it is justified to have a DP for (some) depending on circumstances of their capability of thinking like your saying we all" have & will do again. Murder for the personal desire they want to murder. As prison has proven. This isn't even remotely logical. No state "needs" capital punishment. It's hardly ever used and as such can never serve as moral instruction to the people most likely to commit murder. Yes, that was Osk who brought up the movie " Death Wish. We will have to agree to disagree. Only ones who need to be gone are the ones I already mentioned. At least some killers have some value, they kill themselves too. Many very poor people have not nor will kill for or $$$. History & all those mentioned cannot speak for every individual as a 100 % . Also I do not have any victims. Coming from a guy that says, all that murder should get the DP. No 3 degrees,murder is murder. Then according to history etc we would all be dead, no mankind left over the centuries.
|
|
|
Post by whitediamonds on Sept 25, 2018 8:49:03 GMT -6
Speaking for yourself Joe? No, I speak for everyone. Evolution, biology, thousands of years of human history and common sense don't lie. Each and every one of us is capable of murder. That is the whole point of making it illegal. It took Manson 2 yrs to program them (by using drugs, booze, music & isolation. Even Manson knew which ones would be capable of carrying out his plan. How, then, do you explain their convictions? They weren't even held partially to blame. They all got the death penalty. Even sober no remorse, real remorse. No nightmares. Yes, some are capable Manson knew that & also knew not all are, even under those conditions. That sounds like an excuse that anti's use to protect murderers from the DP. This is gibberish. Killing someone, and killing him/her with malice, is not nearly as hard as it sounds. Every one of us can think of a circumstance when s/he would do it, and do it without the slightest degree of guilt. Furthermore those opposed to capital punishment are just as opposed to murder as you are. As a matter of fact, most of the time jurors in capital cases spare the lives of those convicted of murder. Are they making excuses for the killers? You brought up the movie Death Wish in another post reply. Seems to me he had the nerve to walk alone at night & was attacked. He did know he would be, he shot them in self defense. They attacked him first he did not provoke. Speak for yourself I had situations were I may have thought of killing someone, never did. I have always had a gun & know how to use it. Some people find to many excuses to kill not all of us. You cannot speak for all mankind. As far as the DP, some who kill then kill themselves too. We need & it is justified to have a DP for (some) depending on circumstances of their capability of thinking like your saying we all" have & will do again. Murder for the personal desire they want to murder. As prison has proven. Some people commit suicide like some of our vets, hard to live with then come back to life as we live it. Abortion some women say its my body, no if it was your body you would have died. Yes, some find reasons to kill, at least our vets it was self defense ugly but, self defense.
|
|
|
Post by whitediamonds on Sept 21, 2018 9:57:48 GMT -6
how did these young followers get so brutally insanely controlled by him, coming from average backgrounds? This is kind of a stupid question, implying, as it does, that Charles Manson's powers of persuasion were at all extraordinary or formidable. We are each born with sufficient "programming" to commit acts of murder. That is who we are. We are merely waiting for sufficient inducements to do it. Speaking for yourself Joe? It took Manson 2 yrs to program them( by using drugs, booze, music & isolation. Even Manson knew which ones would be capable of carrying out his plan. Even sober no remorse, real remorse. No nightmares. Yes, some are capable Manson knew that & also knew not all are, even under those conditions. That sounds like an excuse that anti's use to protect murderers from the DP. That's like saying only the poor kill.
|
|
|
Post by whitediamonds on Sept 17, 2018 10:56:27 GMT -6
...yet how did these young followers get so brutally insanely controlled by him, coming from average backgrounds? how did Hillary actually get votes? human's are strange creatures. Scary isn't it.
|
|
|
Post by whitediamonds on Sept 17, 2018 9:49:21 GMT -6
Will be about Charles Mason. It;s now 50 yrs ago & he "finally" died at 83 recently.
I Know when will his name & attention go away. From what I understand it is mostly from a child to the gruesome crimes committed, & how he got these young followers of his to be at his command.
The young followers were pretty much like any young impressionable, lost trying to find themselves teens before Mason. It is worth taking a look at how a monster is born. His childhood, jail, prison & even society were all a series of creating a monster.
The large piece of this puzzle is how did he get mental control, besides drugs of course? I mean these murders were insanely gruesome, no human remorse at all. How do you program this kind of mental control?
Look what Hitler did on a mass scale? Scary indeed.
How the hell? I see some insight into what created a monster with Manson, yet how did these young followers get so brutally insanely controlled by him, coming from average backgrounds?
|
|
|
Post by whitediamonds on Sept 10, 2018 19:54:24 GMT -6
I don't know hawg, if were dead we cannot experience being dead what it is like, anymore than we could experience anything before we were even here. Do you have proof of what we experience when were dead? LOL strange conversation. I don't know, but since the state cannot sentence you to fear and apprehension and yet they can sentence you to death, then we take what we can. Plus we're better off with death. I don't know if we are better off with death, what I do know, old age is not for sissies.
|
|
|
Post by whitediamonds on Sept 10, 2018 17:49:36 GMT -6
Sorry, but that won't sell because death is NOT a thing that one experiences. In fact, life is all that you will ever know and nothing more. Hence, you have to exist in order to experience. well aren't you in for a big surprise I don't know hawg, if were dead we cannot experience being dead what it is like, anymore than we could experience anything before we were even here. Do you have proof of what we experience when were dead? LOL strange conversation.
|
|
|
Post by whitediamonds on Sept 4, 2018 17:50:45 GMT -6
I may be wrong but, I think we were saying, it is sadistic to keep them on DR decades. In my opinion the DP should be carriedd out w/in 5 years of sentencing. Ooops messed up quoting hawg's reply i know what you are saying, should even be 2 years. but keeping them on death row for decades is NOT the states doing. it's "he" and/or his attorneys. well, I suppose in all fairness we could blame "state" judges for allowing it to go on. so what if through our pathetic appeals process you manage to make it past 5 or 10 or even 38 years, then what? congratulations, all is forgiven? why sentence anyone to anything? I simply cannot drum up a tear for any age a convicted murderer is finally executed. but that's just me. WD's reply to hawg. lol It is not the state, not sure how the state judges could do more. Even if it makes it to decades to carry out, I personally could care less what age they are in the present time. Who should care is the ones who allow the years to pass, think we all know who plays a big role in that. Shame on them, they are sadistic morons, who torture. Look at the cases where even the day of execution which should go forward at say, 6:00:pm, placing a knowingly bozo appeal to stop the execution. So, for hours they still give them false hope to add to their torture. Execution carried out near midnight instead.
|
|
|
Post by whitediamonds on Sept 4, 2018 10:34:03 GMT -6
I may be wrong but, I think we were saying, it is sadistic to keep them on DR decades. In my opinion the DP should be carriedd out w/in 5 years of sentencing.
|
|
|
Post by whitediamonds on Sept 4, 2018 10:27:55 GMT -6
They´re both interesting documents, but the name of the executioner should be included - and there´s no reason why the name of the doctor involved should be blacked out. sure, like "fuglyville" is your given name that you're so proud to share with us.. how about posting your address and phone number? Fair request Fug.
|
|
|
Post by whitediamonds on Sept 4, 2018 9:18:03 GMT -6
They´re both interesting documents, but the name of the executioner should be included - and there´s no reason why the name of the doctor involved should be blacked out. Yes there is a reason a valid one. To many nut cases out there who make death threats. Like the abortion issue too same thing happens. Maybe we should list all who have an abortion too & who perform them.
|
|
|
Post by whitediamonds on Aug 25, 2018 8:39:33 GMT -6
Why does it take decades? Sadism! They want to torture the inmates before they kill them. What other reason could they possibly have for killing a sixty year old for crimes he committed when he was was a 22 year old? Right here Oslooskar. What other "reason" could they have for killing him for a crime he committed . That part.
|
|
|
Post by whitediamonds on Aug 24, 2018 17:00:44 GMT -6
Therefore, killing a 60 year old for a murder he committed when he was 22 years old hardly serves that purpose. This is why I felt the victims & their family were left out by you. It still serves a purpose, for them. Agree it is torture to keep him on DR that long though. There are many reasons in this case it took so long. Forgetting Moore was not the reason.
|
|
|
Post by whitediamonds on Aug 23, 2018 11:09:53 GMT -6
do you think that if a convicted murderer can survive to a certain age then the sentence should be commuted? Yes, absolutely! Executions as far as I'm concerned are to be carried out for one specific purpose only and that is to prevent the condemned from killing again. Therefore, killing a 60 year old for a murder he committed when he was 22 years old hardly serves that purpose. Completely forgetting the victims & the families of. Two cab drivers working to support their families.
|
|
|
Post by whitediamonds on Aug 23, 2018 11:03:49 GMT -6
Even Moore stated he was tired of living on DR so long, he did not see his execution as punishment, he had peace & joy & was ready. It was actually a blessing to him.
In Nebraska the DP was restored by voters in 2016 by a 61 to 39 % margin. He did not want another appeal filed.
|
|
|
Post by whitediamonds on Aug 22, 2018 16:37:48 GMT -6
Or have the same order sent for the media there. Paula Dryers last meal ( after getting out of school ) was a can of corn & peas, that should have been the menu for the pos & the media, that would would do both, make it justifiable. [/quote] I did hawk, that was her last meal. Should have been the pos's last meal too.
|
|
|
Post by whitediamonds on Aug 19, 2018 18:51:01 GMT -6
It is not the state, it is the appeals process.
|
|
|
Post by whitediamonds on Aug 17, 2018 10:17:23 GMT -6
Why does it take decades?
|
|