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Post by Bob on Aug 27, 2003 12:11:43 GMT -6
This punishment reflects the will of the people Louisiana and it should certainly be respected by the courts. But it probably won't be.
LOUISIANA--- Jury decides on death penalty for child-rapist
A man who was convicted of raping his 8-year-old stepdaughter was sentenced to death Tuesday.
The man, whose identity was not released to protect his victim, was convicted of aggravated rape Monday for an attack that occurred 5 years ago. After nearly 2 hours of deliberations Tuesday, the same jury sentenced him to death.
Under a Louisiana law adopted in 1995, the death penalty can be sought for aggravated rape if the victim is under the age of 12. The other penalty is a mandatory sentence of life in prison without parole.
Dr. Scott Benton, an expert on child sex abuse, told jurors that the girl's injuries were the worst he had seen resulting from sexual assault.
The girl was attacked on March 2, 1998. At first the girl told police that she was raped by a young man as she sorted Girl Scout cookies in the open garage of her Woodmere home. But 21 months later, she told her mother that the defendant had raped her.
Jefferson Parish sheriff's deputies said they suspected the stepfather almost from the start because 2 hours before he called to report the rape, he called 2 different men asking about getting blood out of a carpet, saying to one man that the relative "became a lady today."
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Post by Deleted on Aug 27, 2003 15:42:01 GMT -6
This punishment reflects the will of the people Louisiana and it should certainly be respected by the courts. But it probably won't be. LOUISIANA--- Jury decides on death penalty for child-rapist A man who was convicted of raping his 8-year-old stepdaughter was sentenced to death Tuesday. The man, whose identity was not released to protect his victim, was convicted of aggravated rape Monday for an attack that occurred 5 years ago. After nearly 2 hours of deliberations Tuesday, the same jury sentenced him to death. Under a Louisiana law adopted in 1995, the death penalty can be sought for aggravated rape if the victim is under the age of 12. The other penalty is a mandatory sentence of life in prison without parole. Dr. Scott Benton, an expert on child sex abuse, told jurors that the girl's injuries were the worst he had seen resulting from sexual assault. The girl was attacked on March 2, 1998. At first the girl told police that she was raped by a young man as she sorted Girl Scout cookies in the open garage of her Woodmere home. But 21 months later, she told her mother that the defendant had raped her. Jefferson Parish sheriff's deputies said they suspected the stepfather almost from the start because 2 hours before he called to report the rape, he called 2 different men asking about getting blood out of a carpet, saying to one man that the relative "became a lady today." It's a terrible thing that happened to that little girl. And it would be nice if we could give her father something a bit more harsh than prison time. But I think that IF the death penalty has to exist at all, it should be reserved for murderers. |
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Post by D.E.E. on Aug 27, 2003 15:43:59 GMT -6
It's a terrible thing that happened to that little girl. And it would be nice if we could give her father something a bit more harsh than prison time. But I think that IF the death penalty has to exist at all, it should be reserved for murderers. I do not know in a case like this the DP may be the correct thing. If it is in LA law and the Supremes have not struck it down I see no problem with it at all. |
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Post by Bob on Aug 27, 2003 17:46:19 GMT -6
I would also prefer to see the death penalty limited to murder and offences committed against the nation in wartime.
However the question is, should the courts take it upon themselves to strike it down?
I would say - absolutely not! That puts the courts into the business of usurping the role of the legislatures. Unless a punishment is both cruel and unusual, the courts have no business striking down the legislation. And the death penalty for the rape of a child is not in the category of "cruel and unusual" punishment.
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Scott
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"Capital punishment is a government program, so skepticism is in order." (George Will)
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Post by Scott on Aug 27, 2003 18:04:29 GMT -6
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Post by Bob on Aug 27, 2003 19:33:14 GMT -6
Yes I should perhaps have addressed definitions. That Letourneau case is a crime that probably should not even be defined as "rape". As you can guess, I did not mean to include "statutory rape" in this.
It appears that this particular crime in Louisiana was horrendous and very violent.
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Post by D.E.E. on Aug 27, 2003 20:42:24 GMT -6
[/img] [/quote] Now that is quite a jump even for you isn't it. A case of statutory rape and a physically violent crime against a very young child. However I must ask you if it were your daughter and a male teacher con her in to having sex with him at age 12 what would you want done to him? Maybe you see it different if it was a female instead of a male that was the minor. |
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Post by halfpint on Aug 27, 2003 20:52:08 GMT -6
That's a tough one....... would it be too harsh to suggest castration instead of execution for sexual crimes that violent? Just an idea......  |
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Post by D.E.E. on Aug 27, 2003 20:56:55 GMT -6
That's a tough one....... would it be too harsh to suggest castration instead of execution for sexual crimes that violent? Just an idea...... I am all for castration for all violent sexual crimes. The law in this case allows for the DP for a violent sexual crime commited on a child under a set age I do not see a problem with the court giving the criminal in question the DP. |
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Post by halfpint on Aug 27, 2003 21:08:41 GMT -6
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Post by D.E.E. on Aug 27, 2003 21:13:30 GMT -6
The truth be known, I have no idea anymore what I think... Two days ago I would have said absolutley not, the man should just be put away forever with no chance of ever getting out. Now after reading this forum, and reading stuff on the internet for the last two days, I am completely confused.   Yes it is hard to know what is right and what is wrong. I am not usually for DP for most sexually violent crimes but for a child that young well I would not argue against the DP for him. I would not be unhappy if he received LOWP either espically since LA is one state that means it when they say LWOP. Of course if he is put in general pop then he will not do to well anyway. Most prisoners do not like child molesters and tend to show it in ways that are not nice. |
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Post by halfpint on Aug 27, 2003 21:18:44 GMT -6
Forgive me for asking silly questions that are off topic, but I am a Death Penalty Discussion Board "Virgin", so what is LOWP? We don't have the death penatly here so I am new to this.....  And back on topic, I guess it doesn't make sense for me to be against the death penalty when I hope you're right, and they do put a man like that in the Gen. Pop., so that he can be disposed of.. he's an awful man.... |
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Post by Deleted on Aug 28, 2003 6:47:36 GMT -6
I do not know in a case like this the DP may be the correct thing. If it is in LA law and the Supremes have not struck it down I see no problem with it at all. Well, obviously that makes it LEGAL. But just because it's legal does not make it okay. |
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Post by Deleted on Aug 28, 2003 6:51:03 GMT -6
Now that is quite a jump even for you isn't it. A case of statutory rape and a physically violent crime against a very young child. However I must ask you if it were your daughter and a male teacher con her in to having sex with him at age 12 what would you want done to him? Maybe you see it different if it was a female instead of a male that was the minor. Obviously, most people would want terrible things to happen to anyone who did that to their child. However, if we were allowed to do whatever felt appropriate every time someone wronged us, the world would be in really bad shape. How many times have we all wanted to punch someone in the nose for something they did that made us angry? It's an understandable sentiment, but it doesn't make it okay to do so. This is precisely why I think laws and sentencing should be left to those with an objective opinion. |
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Post by D.E.E. on Aug 28, 2003 11:19:20 GMT -6
Forgive me for asking silly questions that are off topic, but I am a Death Penalty Discussion Board "Virgin", so what is LOWP? We don't have the death penatly here so I am new to this..... And back on topic, I guess it doesn't make sense for me to be against the death penalty when I hope you're right, and they do put a man like that in the Gen. Pop., so that he can be disposed of.. he's an awful man.... I am sorry I typed LOWP and meant LWOP (Life with out Parole). |
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Post by D.E.E. on Aug 28, 2003 11:29:19 GMT -6
Obviously, most people would want terrible things to happen to anyone who did that to their child. However, if we were allowed to do whatever felt appropriate every time someone wronged us, the world would be in really bad shape. How many times have we all wanted to punch someone in the nose for something they did that made us angry? It's an understandable sentiment, but it doesn't make it okay to do so. This is precisely why I think laws and sentencing should be left to those with an objective opinion. The thing is he was bringing in a case where a woman had received time for sexually molesting a young boy and he was tying it in to a violent sex act against a very young girl. The part of me asking if it was his daughter instead of a boy is actually asking "how would you look at the same case if it had been a girl who was seduced by her teacher and not a boy". Seems to be a double standard when it is a boy having sex with a woman and a girl with a man." I see both as rape and both should receive time in prison. How would you see it. Now about the other case, if the man violently sexually attacked a girl under the age of 12 and the state of Lousiana says it is legal to execute him then I do not see a problem. I feel deserves it but would not be really unhappy to see LWOP either are fitting punishments. It is the law and not me doing it, I would not be any where near as nice as the law will be. |
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Post by Donna in England on Aug 28, 2003 18:05:05 GMT -6
I have to agree. I think all child molesters/child rapists (anything remotely sexual towards a child) should be executed. These people cannot be rehabilitated and our governments are wasting precious resources in trying to rehabilitate them, sending them back to the community, and having them back in again.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 29, 2003 9:12:42 GMT -6
I have to agree. I think all child molesters/child rapists (anything remotely sexual towards a child) should be executed. These people cannot be rehabilitated and our governments are wasting precious resources in trying to rehabilitate them, sending them back to the community, and having them back in again. Donna, how do you know they can not be rehabilitated? Obviously, you may be right. But it seems to me like very little effort is being made to do the necessary research to find out. You never know....it COULD be possible. Why not get a team of psychologists, psychiatrists, and sociologists together to work on finding out? |
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Post by D.E.E. on Aug 29, 2003 13:02:01 GMT -6
Donna, how do you know they can not be rehabilitated? Obviously, you may be right. But it seems to me like very little effort is being made to do the necessary research to find out. You never know....it COULD be possible. Why not get a team of psychologists, psychiatrists, and sociologists together to work on finding out? As I understand it from several Psychologist and Sociologist that do work in the field of criminal justice it is pretty much already proven that you can not cure a pedofile. |
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Post by FromTheHip on Aug 29, 2003 16:10:45 GMT -6
T'aint no cure for violent sexual predators. Its their very sexual orientation. Can't be cured of that any mroe than you can be cured of being hetero or homosexual. As I understand it from several Psychologist and Sociologist that do work in the field of criminal justice it is pretty much already proven that you can not cure a pedofile. |
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Post by D.E.E. on Aug 30, 2003 17:43:46 GMT -6
T'aint no cure for violent sexual predators. Its their very sexual orientation. Can't be cured of that any mroe than you can be cured of being hetero or homosexual. That is my understanding as well and it is one of the reasons I support the DP for some who rape children. This is of course not the same as the sick woman who had sex with a minor and was convicted of Statuatory Rape as she should have been and given a lenghty prison term. I would not advocate the DP of that act. |
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Post by Donnie on Sept 2, 2003 10:19:37 GMT -6
T'aint no cure for violent sexual predators. Its their very sexual orientation. There is a frightful article about this in the current issue of Psychology Today magazine (last time I saw one at a newstand, a new issue may be out now). It was written by a sexual predator who claimed to be nonviolent. |
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Post by Felix on Oct 6, 2003 4:16:46 GMT -6
my concern is that if he is given the DP, wont this encourage other child rapists to kill their victims?
Not convinced this is a good move for the victims, though he is one absolute piece of crap!
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Post by Deleted on Oct 6, 2003 8:17:58 GMT -6
I use to support the DP for all heinous acts.
Went away from that over the years due to a lot of stuff like misconduct, wrongful incarcerations, etc.
But, child murderers, where the proof is absolute.......they still in my book need a clear path to the gurney, due to the very nature of their crime.
The truly innocent nature of a child deserves the highest protection we can offer.
Because of the very nature of these sexual fiends, and the very real fact that they cannot be rehabilitated, for me means we are just delaying the inevitable if we release them or give light sentences.
In cases where the murderer has not given the full details, I think LWOP should be maintained, i.e. Moors Murders case as an example.
I don't know enough of the whole of this case discussed here, but I did find it odd the DP was used, yet on the other hand.....the child's life, the innocence was taken......so should in circumstances with 100% proof.......the life of the perp.
I know it goes against my stance, but for crimes against children, I really feel the DP serves justice best.
Here is a good one:
Picked up my paper I get delivered every morning.
Almost spit my coffee out all over the place when I read that the local prison is going to start doing `work in the community` schemes.
Now, little known to people here, the prison I speak of is Peterhead Prison, which is famous for a programme called STOP.
The prison was almost shut down last year (old and smelly and the gov want to build new ones) and all hell broke loose, cause the peds in there would of been transferred, and no programme were set in other Scottish prisons.
The prison was given a chance and that to me was a good move.
The programme in question is world renown for their work with peds, so to have that programme still in action is better than the option of nothing.
But, to allow these `beasts` to come out and work in our community?
They are joking?!
I tell you I'm keeping my eye on this situation cause I will be the first one in the front line protesting if Aberdeenshire Council think they are going to put my 13yr old daughter at risk, so they can be some kind of liberal council thinking they are doing good.
It is bad enough that these peds come out into our local community, stay 3 streets away from my house every weekend (this happens towards the end of their term - reintroduction to society) and we never get told who they are or warned.
But to actually invite these peds to work in our community is inviting trouble for all our kids.
Just goes to show you, that our children still these days are not protected enough and if LA did this, kudos to them.
And yes, it is a real fear children who might of just been raped (did I actually say that, sounds disgusting, sounds like I make light, no intention meant) might now be killed in the state of LA, but…..there are risks in everything in life, but there should not be any leeway given to anyone who harms a child…….none!
LWOP if it means that in LA is not a bad thing……but for these predators……..sometimes erasing them from the face of the earth is the best thing you can do for the child (fear factor growing up) and the best thing for society (no more notches on the peds belt).
Take care,
Bobbie
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Post by tharden on Oct 14, 2003 19:51:30 GMT -6
We don't just hand out the death penalty for anything and we shouldn't. Even most murders don't get the death penalty. We save the death penalty for the most brutal of crimes. Isn't a man raping a child that young and small one of the most brutal crimes you can thing of?
There was a comparrison made about females who commit statutory rape to this crime. I hate to say it but a child who is sexually abused by a female doesn't suffer the pain that children this young and small suffer after being raped by a man. If that is sexist then it just is - I am a man btw - and I make an apology for it.
Someone mentioned that pedophilia is a sexual orientation just like hetro or homo and it can't be changed just like the 2 main accepted sexual orientations. What nobody has brought up is that to have a sexual orientation like this man in LA has a predator also has to have either a sadistic streak or, at the very least, no regard for the pain and suffering of others. Can you imagine how much that little girl must have cried and hurt? A criminal has to be rough to cause pain to that degree even to an adult but to a - child?! To me we're talking about executing the most rabid of the human species here and I can't see a problem with that.
I welcome all comments to this post.
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Post by aussie on Oct 16, 2003 3:54:16 GMT -6
We don't just hand out the death penalty for anything and we shouldn't. Even most murders don't get the death penalty. We save the death penalty for the most brutal of crimes. Isn't a man raping a child that young and small one of the most brutal crimes you can thing of? There was a comparrison made about females who commit statutory rape to this crime. I hate to say it but a child who is sexually abused by a female doesn't suffer the pain that children this young and small suffer after being raped by a man. If that is sexist then it just is - I am a man btw - and I make an apology for it. Someone mentioned that pedophilia is a sexual orientation just like hetro or homo and it can't be changed just like the 2 main accepted sexual orientations. What nobody has brought up is that to have a sexual orientation like this man in LA has a predator also has to have either a sadistic streak or, at the very least, no regard for the pain and suffering of others. Can you imagine how much that little girl must have cried and hurt? A criminal has to be rough to cause pain to that degree even to an adult but to a - child?! To me we're talking about executing the most rabid of the human species here and I can't see a problem with that. I welcome all comments to this post. What can I say, you are spot on here. Will be interesting watching the responces to your post. |
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