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Post by Deleted on Jun 10, 2003 20:29:01 GMT -6
I received this today on the front page of the PHADP newsletter. I was shocked as I had no idea that Michael had written this. I am not posting this for anyone to reply to as a matter of fact I wish that you wouldnt reply. Just wanted to share his thoughts with you all so that perhaps you would better understand him. TEXT Will You Hear Me Now? By: Michael Thompson Executed by the State of Alabama 3/13/03 Judicial prejudice and malice, prosecutorial misconduct, ineffective assistance of counsel, involuntary confessions forced by promises, threats and trickery, the failure of investigators to produce favorable evidence while creating unfavorable, false evidence- these are the components that not only violate the rights of the guilty, but also convict the innocent. Components of a system of justice, which has run amok for far too long under the guise of “being tough on crime” from the Circuit Courts to the U. S. Supreme Court. When our highest judiciary fails to enforce the rights guaranteed to every individual under the United States Constitution, society as a whole inherits a corrupt system of justice that functions not to protect, but to prosecute and only fools would believe that the innocent are NOT convicted, and even put to death. A corrupt, zealous justice system can make the most innocent among us appear to be guilty monsters, especially with the assistance of the “spin doctors” media who graduate from the Jerry Springer school of “shock TV.”<br> Today, the State of Alabama has put to death an innocent man. Since I’m already dead and have NOTHING to gain, perhaps society will finally listen. My blood is on your hands, but I’ve prayed that God will forgive you all, for you don’t realize what you are doing. You are kept in ignorance of the truth and made to believe that our justice system is perfect and that it’s hard at work protecting you from people like me. I spent 18 years behind bars for a crime that I did NOT commit and now I’ve been put to death. You should fear the system that did this to me. On December 10th, 1984 I found myself caught up in something that resembled a segment from the TV series “The Twilight Zone”, and it chewed me up like a lion devouring fresh kill. Every twist and turn only sunk me deeper and deeper until, had I not known better, even I would have thought myself to be guilty. The justice system devoured me. It took an innocent man and ripped him to shreds and devoured him. I was THAT MAN. My only reason for leaving you this last statement is to beg you to please put an end to this madness. Stop the killing! At least a live person stands a chance of one day proving his innocence. Don’t ever murder an innocent person again. Let my execution be the END of the death penalty in Alabama. I love this State, I love the people in this state. Please love yourselves enough to rise above this evil and be a Godly people and a just people for today as I was executed, you were the only ones present who were guilty of murder. I am a Christian, a born again child of God, and all I feel is love and forgiveness. I choose to see my execution as a sacrifice. A wake up call to you. You have executed and innocent man! I’m with God, but you are not, and I pray that you will be one day, for Jesus died for your sins also. But you must repent and ask yourself? What would Jesus DO? Please stop the killing. It’s not God’s will – IT’S MAN’S WILL. GOD LOVE YOU ALL!
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Post by TexasLady on Jun 11, 2003 5:49:40 GMT -6
'The Alabama Supreme Court set a March 13 execution date for Michael Eugene Thompson, who was convicted of the robbery, kidnapping and murder of a convenience store clerk in Attalla more than 18 years ago. The state Supreme Court set the execution date Tuesday at the request of the attorney general's office after the U.S. Supreme Court turned back appeals from Thompson. Thompson's attorney, Mark Gombiner of New York, said he was reviewing his options and had not decided what approach to take in trying to halt the execution. The victim, Maisie Carlene Gray, was working alone at the Majik Mart convenience store in Attalla on the night of Dec. 10, 1984. Thompson, carrying a .22 caliber pistol, forced Maisie to empty the cash register and then forced her into his car and left the area. After driving around for some time, Thompson took Maisie to a well and forced her into it, shooting into the well several times, until he ran out of ammunition. Then he drove to his girlfriend's home, picked up more bullets, and returned with her to the well. While his girlfriend, Shirley Franklin held a homemade torch, Thompson fired seven or eight more shots into the well to make sure Maisie Gray was dead. The next day Thompson took the pistol, which he and Shirley had cleaned, and threw it into another well. On January 5, 1985, law enforcement authorities received a call from Shirley Franklin's husband, reporting that he knew where the victim of the Majik Mart robbery was and who had taken her. When the officers arrived at the man's home, Shirley Franklin told the officers that Thompson had killed Maisie and where the victim's body was located. The police found the body at the well, obtained a statement from Shirley Franklin, and arrested Thompson the same day. At the time of arrest, Thompson refused to sign a waiver of his Miranda rights. However, on the following day, after a visit from Shirley Franklin, he signed a waiver of his rights and gave a taped confession in which he admitted to the robbery, kidnapping and murder. Two days later, Thompson was re-interrogated and again admitted his guilt and gave a similar account of the crime. Thompson was convicted of capital murder on May 10, 1985, and his jury unanimously recommended a death sentence, which the trial judge imposed. The U.S. Supreme Court declined to review Thompson's conviction in 1987. He filed another appeal, claiming he had an ineffective attorney at trial, but the U.S. Supreme Court declined to review that issue in 1992. The U.S. Supreme Court turned back another appeal in June 2002. The appeal contended that investigators forced Thompson into confessing to the crime because they promised not to prosecute his girlfriend for capital murder if he talked, Gombiner said. Alabama's death penalty law will allow Thompson to choose whether he wants to die by lethal injection or in the electric chair at Holman Prison in Atmore. UPDATE: After the execution, Evelyn Elliott, Gray's daughter, said she was disappointed that Thompson showed no remorse toward her or her two brothers who watched him die. "He did not look in our direction or offer any apology," Elliott said. "It was horrible ... but if anyone deserved to die, it was him."'www.prodeathpenalty.com/Pending/03/mar03.htm
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Post by D.E.E. on Jun 11, 2003 6:18:41 GMT -6
You mean he was not innocent? Well imagine that a convict who claimed to be innocent and was not. The problem with ones like this is it makes it hard for those that are actually innocent to find justice.
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Post by TexasLady on Jun 11, 2003 6:25:32 GMT -6
You mean he was not innocent? Well imagine that a convict who claimed to be innocent and was not. The problem with ones like this is it makes it hard for those that are actually innocent to find justice. Well, he's "with God now". Bet he'll have a much tougher time convincing that judge of his innocence.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 11, 2003 7:45:35 GMT -6
So was he or wasn't he. We have his words, and a copy and paste of the state's words. Where is the in-between?
And yep he is most probably with God now...but didn't pro peeps know that.....they don't go to hell when they are given the last rites at the execution cell, cause as it is deemed, Jesus you know...died for a reason, to absolve us all of our sins.
And at least he is with God, who has the most rights to judgement.
Take care, Bobbie
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Post by D.E.E. on Jun 11, 2003 8:41:21 GMT -6
So was he or wasn't he. We have his words, and a copy and paste of the state's words. Where is the in-between? And yep he is most probably with God now...but didn't pro peeps know that.....they don't go to hell when they are given the last rites at the execution cell, cause as it is deemed, Jesus you know...died for a reason, to absolve us all of our sins. And at least he is with God, who has the most rights to judgement. Take care, Bobbie Well I for one do not know if he is in Heaven or Hell. I do know what the bible says about it and unless he confessed his sins before man and accepted Jesus as his lord and Savior then according to the Bible he is not in heaven. Of course I am not strictly speaking a believer in all the Bible says, it has been edited too many times and handed down verbally too long. Also not all of the writtings of the Disciples are in the bible who. So he may or may not be in heaven, either way he is gone and it sounds like he should be.
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Post by steiner1014 on Jun 11, 2003 12:58:10 GMT -6
Cry me a river buddy!!!
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Post by Donnie on Jun 13, 2003 17:10:18 GMT -6
I had no idea that Michael had written this. "Since I’m already dead and have NOTHING to gain, perhaps society will finally listen." None of us has any idea whether he wrote it or not. Of course he also had NOTHING to lose by writing it either. Also, society listened to him and his lawyers for years. But society did not listen to his victime because he took her freedom of speech when he took everything else she had.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 13, 2003 23:47:24 GMT -6
TEXTI can assure you of two things. I dont lie and IF he had not written this himself, Project Hope would NOT have published it on the front page of their newsletter.
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Post by azfrankie on Jun 14, 2003 8:43:00 GMT -6
Well, as in the thread "Should the Death Penalty apply to Debra Milke?" - where neither GlenF. nor TexasLady were able to respond to all the TRUE details of her case - this again seems to be a horrible misacrriage of justice. Much worse, it matches 100% with all the overzealous activities I've digged out in Debra's case. The supporters of those death sentences have little to say but to reproduce official documents, largely miscontrued and taken out of context. It makes me worry a lot. Why should a person continue to lie, even on the day of his execution? He has no more evidence to present, and if he was indeed guilty he would most likely just keep his mouth shut. This man didn't. We should give it a second thought. The death penalty can be just where justice is proven. But I'm getting more and more petrified at the thought of how many cases popped up where falsified details unraveled and eventually surfaced. Why do state attorneys oppose to grant a convict a DNA test? Why do cops fabricate or falisfy testimonies? Why do state government's continue to fight ex-con's who were exonerated (even by DNA) and continue to waste tax dollars? Just to be "tough on crime"? And - what worries me even more - how many guilty people continue to walk the streets undisturbed? I'm sad ...
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Post by azfrankie on Jun 14, 2003 9:20:16 GMT -6
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Post by Donnie on Jun 15, 2003 21:13:35 GMT -6
Why should a person continue to lie, even on the day of his execution? He has no more evidence to present, and if he was indeed guilty he would most likely just keep his mouth shut. There are almost as many reasons for people to lie as there are liars. However, one reason is that many liars discover that by telling lies they can get attention from others. I have known many convincing liars who seemingly had nothing to gain from their lies. Impending death is certainly no reason to avoid telling a a lie. In fact, in the case of impending execution, there is a strong incentive to tell big lies. There is a chance of earthly immortality with no potential consequences if the lie is found out. There is certainly no reason for a guilty murderer to keep his mouth shut if he wants people to think that he was innocent. Telling lies would be just one more way to get back at the "system" for the effrontry it displayed in punishing the murderer for his crimes. Some murderers consider themselves above the law and are sincerely offended that they are expected to pay for their crimes.
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Post by Donnie on Jun 15, 2003 21:17:48 GMT -6
So was he or wasn't he. We have his words, and a copy and paste of the state's words. Where is the in-between? He was guilty. There was a trial, remember. There were also three appeals to the suprem court. Your statement implies that it was just a "he-said, she-said", type of situation.
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Post by felix on Jun 19, 2003 7:24:37 GMT -6
it is interesting reading what all you pro,s write about this amns last words. He said you ought to be afraid of this system becauise if he is innocent, it could easily happen to you. Personally I dont know one way or the other, but I would not sleep easy contributing to his death unless I was totally black and white in my reasoning and failed to see grey areas?
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Post by D.E.E. on Jun 19, 2003 10:23:44 GMT -6
it is interesting reading what all you pro,s write about this amns last words. He said you ought to be afraid of this system becauise if he is innocent, it could easily happen to you. Personally I dont know one way or the other, but I would not sleep easy contributing to his death unless I was totally black and white in my reasoning and failed to see grey areas? What Gray area he was guilty. Most of us do see shades of black and white which means gray to you, but when a criminal is guilty and is executed what is gray about that? Have you ever worked with criminals?
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jun 19, 2003 18:26:12 GMT -6
I received this today on the front page of the PHADP newsletter. I was shocked as I had no idea that Michael had written this. I am not posting this for anyone to reply to as a matter of fact I wish that you wouldnt reply. Just wanted to share his thoughts with you all so that perhaps you would better understand him. TEXT Will You Hear Me Now? By: Michael Thompson Executed by the State of Alabama 3/13/03 Judicial prejudice and malice, prosecutorial misconduct, ineffective assistance of counsel, involuntary confessions forced by promises, threats and trickery, the failure of investigators to produce favorable evidence while creating unfavorable, false evidence- these are the components that not only violate the rights of the guilty, but also convict the innocent. Components of a system of justice, which has run amok for far too long under the guise of “being tough on crime” from the Circuit Courts to the U. S. Supreme Court. When our highest judiciary fails to enforce the rights guaranteed to every individual under the United States Constitution, society as a whole inherits a corrupt system of justice that functions not to protect, but to prosecute and only fools would believe that the innocent are NOT convicted, and even put to death. A corrupt, zealous justice system can make the most innocent among us appear to be guilty monsters, especially with the assistance of the “spin doctors” media who graduate from the Jerry Springer school of “shock TV.”<br> Today, the State of Alabama has put to death an innocent man. Since I’m already dead and have NOTHING to gain, perhaps society will finally listen. My blood is on your hands, but I’ve prayed that God will forgive you all, for you don’t realize what you are doing. You are kept in ignorance of the truth and made to believe that our justice system is perfect and that it’s hard at work protecting you from people like me. I spent 18 years behind bars for a crime that I did NOT commit and now I’ve been put to death. You should fear the system that did this to me. On December 10th, 1984 I found myself caught up in something that resembled a segment from the TV series “The Twilight Zone”, and it chewed me up like a lion devouring fresh kill. Every twist and turn only sunk me deeper and deeper until, had I not known better, even I would have thought myself to be guilty. The justice system devoured me. It took an innocent man and ripped him to shreds and devoured him. I was THAT MAN. My only reason for leaving you this last statement is to beg you to please put an end to this madness. Stop the killing! At least a live person stands a chance of one day proving his innocence. Don’t ever murder an innocent person again. Let my execution be the END of the death penalty in Alabama. I love this State, I love the people in this state. Please love yourselves enough to rise above this evil and be a Godly people and a just people for today as I was executed, you were the only ones present who were guilty of murder. I am a Christian, a born again child of God, and all I feel is love and forgiveness. I choose to see my execution as a sacrifice. A wake up call to you. You have executed and innocent man! I’m with God, but you are not, and I pray that you will be one day, for Jesus died for your sins also. But you must repent and ask yourself? What would Jesus DO? Please stop the killing. It’s not God’s will – IT’S MAN’S WILL. GOD LOVE YOU ALL! Ever hear of'THOU SHALT NOT MURDER"
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Post by Donnie on Jun 22, 2003 21:26:49 GMT -6
it is interesting reading what all you pro,s write about this amns last words. He said you ought to be afraid of this system becauise if he is innocent, it could easily happen to you. Personally I dont know one way or the other, but I would not sleep easy contributing to his death unless I was totally black and white in my reasoning and failed to see grey areas? At some point you need to face reality. There are hundreds of things that cause accidental death in the US and in the world. Accidental death by execution is virtually nonexistent. Accidental execution could not easily happen to me or anyone else in the US. I could not be easily executed even if I actually killed somebody. The raw probability of execution of a guilty murderer is about 1 in 2,000. I could be more easily killed by lightning or a falling airplane. It is more likely that I could be killed intentionally by a murderer.
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Post by bueller007 on Jun 23, 2003 0:26:08 GMT -6
The raw probability of execution of a guilty murderer is about 1 in 2,000. Could you provide a source for that number, and explain how it really fits in the context of your argument? I could be more easily killed by lightning or a falling airplane. As shocking as this may sound people, it is not hyperbole. According to the National Safety Council, lifetime odds of death by execution are 1 in 40,420, odds of death by lightning are 1 in 55,578. Assuming that most people on death row are guilty, then yes, chances of innocent people being executed are quite miniscule. But, I'll point out a fallacy in your logic. You often say that more murderers should be executed (often to point out that we cannot determine if there is a deterrant effect to the DP since only a small percentage of murderers are executed). If all convicted murderers were executed, that means that more innocent people would be executed, and the above statement would no longer be true. It is more likely that I could be killed intentionally by a murderer. Can't disagree with you there. Odds in the US are 1 in 211. Too bad there are no numbers on what the odds of you being killed by an escaped or released convicted murderer are...Although I'm sure they are still higher than the odds of an innocent person being executed. (If you have such numbers, I would love to see a source.) I don't really like your argument though. Yes, lots of things can cause accidental death. Some of them are even through human error, such as the metaphorical airplane that falls from the sky, possibly due to pilot error. The difference is that such an accident doesn't intentionally cause death, whereas a mistake in the legal system using the death penalty does, and is quite easily preventable, by deciding not to kill them in the first place. Do you think that prosecutors sleep well at night knowing that they have put an innocent man to his death, because they were just doing their jobs and it is "part of the system"? I'm sure that most would feel at least a hint of guilt, even though they are only one part of the machinery. Jurors and "expert witnesses" as well. I'm sure that they would feel a lot worse about it if he died than if the innocent party had "merely" been imprisoned. Yes, the guilt may be unfounded, since they did the best with the evidence at hand. Thus, I suggest (and yes, you saw it coming) that the problem is the existence of the DP, which can be disposed of with no adverse effects, if the prison system is fixed to prevent re-release or escape of dangerous offenders. No death penalty, no executions of innocent people. It seems that pro-DP people often talk about "what would the victims say/want if they were still alive". Too bad we can't ask any of the innocent people who have been executed whether or not they think it's an acceptable risk. Although I'm all for socialist government programs, I don't think that one person should have to die in order to (possibly) benefit society by (possibly) preventing the murder of other people at some future point in time. And to me, there's just something exceptionally repulsive about the government strapping in an innocent person and killing them. Moreso even than when they do it to a guilty person. Moreso than when a single human being does it to another. Your own tax dollars you paid to the body that is supposed to protect you went to the system that convicted you and the poison being pushed into your veins... There's just something inherently wrong with a system that alleges to protect the innocent by killing the guilty as well as some of the innocent.
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Post by Donnie on Jun 23, 2003 3:21:27 GMT -6
Could you provide a source for that number, and explain how it really fits in the context of your argument? That is a rough number. You can develop a more accurate number yourself by using the number of murderers executed from 1976 to 2000 then using an estimate of the number of guilty murderers who are not convicted. That would include guilty murderers acquitted, those who plea bargin to a lessor offense, those arrested but never brought to trial and those never arrested. Guilt is absolute for every murder, regardless of the judicial outcome. So each year you could simply compare the number of murders with the number of executions.
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Post by Donnie on Jun 23, 2003 3:23:56 GMT -6
Could you provide a source for that number, and explain how it really fits in the context of your argument? As shocking as this may sound people, it is not hyperbole. According to the National Safety Council, lifetime odds of death by execution are 1 in 40,420, odds of death by lightning are 1 in 55,578. Assuming that most people on death row are guilty, then yes, chances of innocent people being executed are quite miniscule. But, I'll point out a fallacy in your logic. You often say that more murderers should be executed (often to point out that we cannot determine if there is a deterrant effect to the DP since only a small percentage of murderers are executed). If all convicted murderers were executed, that means that more innocent people would be executed, and the above statement would no longer be true. We could easily double the number of executions of murderers without increasing the likelihood of executing an innocent person.
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Post by bueller007 on Jun 23, 2003 15:36:10 GMT -6
We could easily double the number of executions of murderers without increasing the likelihood of executing an innocent person. Without altering your current system to increase accuracy, simple mathematics dictates that if there is a set proportion of innocent people convicted of murder, that if you execute more convicted murderers, you will execute more innocent people.
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Post by Donnie on Jun 26, 2003 21:10:18 GMT -6
Without altering your current system to increase accuracy, simple mathematics dictates that if there is a set proportion of innocent people convicted of murder, that if you execute more convicted murderers, you will execute more innocent people. In fact there is probably no proportion at all. So simple mathmatics dictates nothing in this case.
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Post by bueller007 on Jul 4, 2003 17:58:13 GMT -6
In fact there is probably no proportion at all. So simple mathmatics dictates nothing in this case. It's irresponsible to believe that no innocent people have been, or will be, executed. Any pro who has done the research (or has even an iota of common sense) will admit that there exists the possibility that an innocent person will be executed. Human systems are fallible. It's a simple fact. There's really no use in arguing this point, because if you do, you are simply wrong. You may argue that the odds are small, but not that they are non-existant. The argument that usually comes in return is that the number of innocent people that are executed is significantly less than the number who would be killed by escaped/paroled prisoners. (This, of course, completely ignores the fact that the problem herein is not a problem with the lack of the death penalty, but a problem with the current legal/penal system.)
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Post by Donnie on Jul 6, 2003 22:43:08 GMT -6
It's irresponsible to believe that no innocent people have been, or will be, executed. Any pro who has done the research (or has even an iota of common sense) will admit that there exists the possibility that an innocent person will be executed. Human systems are fallible. It's a simple fact. There's really no use in arguing this point, because if you do, you are simply wrong. You may argue that the odds are small, but not that they are non-existant. The argument that usually comes in return is that the number of innocent people that are executed is significantly less than the number who would be killed by escaped/paroled prisoners. (This, of course, completely ignores the fact that the problem herein is not a problem with the lack of the death penalty, but a problem with the current legal/penal system.) Don't claim that your invented argument is my position. Of course there is a possiblity that an innocent person may someday be executed. I have never denied that possiblity. However, many things that are possible never happen. It is not physically possible for all possible things to happen, there are too many possible things and too little time and space. When saving innocent lives is the issue, reality is important and real lives saved are more important than theoretical lives saved. What is irresponsible is to believe that one or two theoretical innocent lives saved are more important than hundreds of real innocent lives saved.
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Macklin
Inactive
The more clearly we see the sovereignty of God, the less preplexed we are by the calamities of men.
Posts: 1,701
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Post by Macklin on Jul 12, 2003 10:35:54 GMT -6
I found this part Of Michael Thompson's Statement very interesting with a sight touch or humor. ..................... "When our highest judiciary fails to enforce the rights guaranteed to every individual under the United States Constitution, society as a whole inherits a corrupt system of justice that functions not to protect, but to prosecute and only fools would believe that the innocent are NOT convicted, and even put to death. A corrupt, zealous justice system can make the most innocent among us appear to be guilty monsters," ------------------------ My Repy: Where the humor comes in is that under the United States Constitution that guarantees the rights of every individual....it did enfore his rights. that is why he ended up executed. He had a trial, was found guilty beyond a reasonable doubt, he had all his appeals...and NOTHING in his appeals was found to be in errors that he claimed... Here Read it for yourself: laws.lp.findlaw.com/11th/0015572opn.htmlThe man was guilty and his Constitional Rights was enfored... he just didn't like the results.
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Post by Kirk on Jul 12, 2003 19:45:34 GMT -6
Ever hear of'THOU SHALT NOT MURDER" The Ten Commandments are from the Bible, there is no evidence from any point in history that proves the Bible is true.
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