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Post by reapwysow on Feb 6, 2012 23:47:36 GMT -6
She deserves a chance.....doesn't she?
JEFFERSON CITY, Mo. -- A Missouri teenager who admitted stabbing, strangling and slitting the throat of a young neighbor girl wrote in her journal on the night of the killing that it was an "ahmazing" and "pretty enjoyable" experience - then headed off to church with a laugh.
The words written by Alyssa Bustamante were read aloud in court Monday as part of a sentencing hearing to determine whether she should get life in prison or something less for the October 2009 murder of her neighbor, 9-year-old Elizabeth Olten, in a small town west of Jefferson City.
Bustamante, 18, sat silently - occasionally glancing at those testifying about her, often looking down or to the side - as law enforcement officers, attorneys and forensics experts read aloud her inner most thoughts that she had recorded as a 15-year-old high school sophomore.
The most poignant part of Monday's testimony came when a handwriting expert described how he was able to see through the blue ink that Bustamante had used in an attempt to cover up her original journal entry on the night of Elizabeth's murder. He then read the entry aloud in court:
"I just f------ killed someone. I strangled them and slit their throat and stabbed them now they're dead. I don't know how to feel atm. It was ahmazing. As soon as you get over the "ohmygawd I can't do this" feeling, it's pretty enjoyable. I'm kinda nervous and shaky though right now. Kay, I gotta go to church now...lol."
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Post by rayozz on Feb 7, 2012 0:25:46 GMT -6
She has had genuine psychiatric problems all of her life. Her parents were out of her life, and her father is still in jail. I think the mother is in rehab.
I admire her grandparents who took Bustamante and her two young twin brothers into their home. I think the task was just too hard for them.
Surprisingly, Bustamante is very talented. A recognised equestrian during her pre-teens, and among the top of her year in class in 2009.
I get the impression she was never stabilised on her meds, until jail.
An horrific murder. I assume she will get LWOP. From 15 years of age until death in jail/prison. There is a soft spot in me that wants me to see her get a new chance at life, but then I think Elizabeth Olton will never get that.
The continuation of her hearing tomorrow will be very interesting. I presume a great deal of 'psychobabble.'
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Post by reapwysow on Feb 7, 2012 0:53:56 GMT -6
"I just f------ killed someone. I strangled them and slit their throat and stabbed them now they're dead. I don't know how to feel atm. It was ahmazing. As soon as you get over the "ohmygawd I can't do this" feeling, it's pretty enjoyable. I'm kinda nervous and shaky though right now. Kay, I gotta go to church now...lol."
Because any psychopath who thinks like this deserves my sympathy.
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Post by Felix2 on Feb 7, 2012 3:49:29 GMT -6
She deserves a chance.....doesn't she? JEFFERSON CITY, Mo. -- A Missouri teenager who admitted stabbing, strangling and slitting the throat of a young neighbor girl wrote in her journal on the night of the killing that it was an "ahmazing" and "pretty enjoyable" experience - then headed off to church with a laugh. The words written by Alyssa Bustamante were read aloud in court Monday as part of a sentencing hearing to determine whether she should get life in prison or something less for the October 2009 murder of her neighbor, 9-year-old Elizabeth Olten, in a small town west of Jefferson City. Bustamante, 18, sat silently - occasionally glancing at those testifying about her, often looking down or to the side - as law enforcement officers, attorneys and forensics experts read aloud her inner most thoughts that she had recorded as a 15-year-old high school sophomore. The most poignant part of Monday's testimony came when a handwriting expert described how he was able to see through the blue ink that Bustamante had used in an attempt to cover up her original journal entry on the night of Elizabeth's murder. He then read the entry aloud in court: "I just f------ killed someone. I strangled them and slit their throat and stabbed them now they're dead. I don't know how to feel atm. It was ahmazing. As soon as you get over the "ohmygawd I can't do this" feeling, it's pretty enjoyable. I'm kinda nervous and shaky though right now. Kay, I gotta go to church now...lol." No she does not deserve a chance, I do not agree that her so called conditions are psychiatric in the sense of nature and degree, there is no evidence of psychosis, voices command or otherwise that would incline me to consider that she might not have been, or be expected to be, in comntrol of her actions and decisions at that time. What she has is "shyte life syndrome", clearly she records her decisions to override her inhibitions about killing someone, but yes, argueablly she has become a psychopath. Despite it being officially a mental disorder in the UK since the amendaments in 2007 to the Mental Health Act 1983, I personally dont agree it should be treated as a mental illness.
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Post by rayozz on Feb 7, 2012 3:57:06 GMT -6
Sympathy perhaps, but a 15 year old girl with lifelong psychiatric problems has got through the cracks due to poor parenting. Different states, schools etc and never having a chance to stabilise on her meds. Unfortunately it happens. In this case events were extreme.
I have no idea what should happen to her.
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Post by Felix2 on Feb 7, 2012 5:16:22 GMT -6
Sympathy perhaps, but a 15 year old girl with lifelong psychiatric problems has got through the cracks due to poor parenting. Different states, schools etc and never having a chance to stabilise on her meds. Unfortunately it happens. In this case events were extreme. I have no idea what should happen to her. But what meds is she on? This is crucial to know, because I personally dotn know of any serious psych medication that is appropriate to prescribe for what seems to amount to the girl have a poor upbringing? That background suggestes general issues anbd the use of the term "psychiatric problems" needs teasing out. Most cri9minals use the term to try to avoid consequences for their actions, but its meaning less without a clear and supported diagnosis. I'd be asking is she schizophrenic, and if so, is that her opinion, her family's opinion, or the opinion of an independant consultant psychiatrist? Then if she has that diagnosis is it a type of schizophrenia that could account for her behaviour that day, for example did she experience command hallucinations, is that documented historically in her case, and were they present at the time of the killing? Sounds to me this girl or her supporters are talking bullshyte, using terms such as psychiatric illness in a general way that is meaningless and being used potentially to help her evade responsibility for her actions. In the account you gave of her writings, she implies she understood it was wromng when she spoke about enjoying the experience once she got past her "initial reluctance". I dotn personally agree with the death penalty but even though she is 15, she remains a very dangerous young woman, if she is doing that at age 15, she is more likely to have formed her so called "moral outlook and compass" on life and the way she behaves and conducts herself. She is likely a formed psychoapth, manipulative, and no doubt learned some of this either from her past circumstnaces and or family. No, I think she shoudl do 40 years minimum subject to review, and only be considered for a staggered release programme if and only if she has fully engaged with any psychological therapy and input as may be identified. Then and only then could a meaningful risk assessment be begun to be formed. The very fact they are trying to avoid jail at thsi point is evidence to my mind this little bytch has not yet taken on board the gravity of what she has done to her poor victim. In my opinion at this point th eissue of her being incarcerated for a lengthy period is simply not the prime issue. In term of declaring any personal interest, I do not know her or her victim, I am an anti and I preactice currently in Mental Health and forensics. As for stabilizing on her "meds" thats a frigging classic. If I had a penny for every shyte parent who wnats me to give their children a diagnosis and tablets I'd be very rich. Its a classic because it allows the parent (with medical collusion) to see their child as "ill", ahving a "pscchiatric issue" in fact anything other that th ereal isseu which is more often than not, the simple truth that theri offspring is a product of their own laziness in avoiding putting boundaries and effort into bringing up their offspring. Its a great little escape the lqaziest of parents look for, because it gets them off the hook for accountability for some of the little shyts they insist on bringing into the world.
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Post by whitediamonds on Feb 7, 2012 7:57:39 GMT -6
Was she on psych meds when she commited this murder I wonder? I went to a psychologist back in 2000 for a few months when I lost so many loved ones back to back thru deaths w/in days. Natural deaths He told me many people I pass in daily life are on some kind of meds. That statement shocked me. I know psychiatric drugs over the yrs have been increasing" amoung school children (perscribed) over yrs past also, while at the same time these school age kids are commiting more acts of violence. This also shocks me. Something odd with this picture?
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Post by Felix2 on Feb 7, 2012 10:31:57 GMT -6
Was she on psych meds when she commited this murder I wonder? I went to a psychologist back in 2000 for a few months when I lost so many loved ones back to back thru deaths w/in days. Natural deaths He told me many people I pass in daily life are on some kind of meds. That statement shocked me. I know psychiatric drugs over the yrs have been increasing" amoung school children (perscribed) over yrs past also, while at the same time these school age kids are commiting more acts of violence. This also shocks me. Something odd with this picture? I agree with you, its not normal to be on such drugs and anybody saying differently might have a vested interest. That said, being on such drugs does not make one an idiot or incapable of acting in a normal manner. A classic is ADHD for which ritalin medication was prescribed with awful side effects, most of those kids had dysfunctional behaviours that were learned from the parents. All of them were happy for "expert" diagnosis because if your kid is ill, then it cant be a behavoiur or issue you are responsible for as a parent, can it? It keeps psychaitrists and drug companies in business, and dont underestimate how financially gainful such expanding diagnosis' can be to such large pharmacutical companies who have a clear vested interest in expandign medical explanations for all behaviour and then masquerading as having a cure. Right now in the US in relation to children the effeort is to sell the idea of "pre-psychosis" in kids being possible to identify, Jeeze talk about George Orwell and his book entitled 1984, its all happening if you look at it from a critical perspective.
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Post by whitediamonds on Feb 7, 2012 11:20:23 GMT -6
Was she on psych meds when she commited this murder I wonder? I went to a psychologist back in 2000 for a few months when I lost so many loved ones back to back thru deaths w/in days. Natural deaths He told me many people I pass in daily life are on some kind of meds. That statement shocked me. I know psychiatric drugs over the yrs have been increasing" amoung school children (perscribed) over yrs past also, while at the same time these school age kids are commiting more acts of violence. This also shocks me. Something odd with this picture? I agree with you, its not normal to be on such drugs and anybody saying differently might have a vested interest. That said, being on such drugs does not make one an idiot or incapable of acting in a normal manner. A classic is ADHD for which ritalin medication was prescribed with awful side effects, most of those kids had dysfunctional behaviours that were learned from the parents. All of them were happy for "expert" diagnosis because if your kid is ill, then it cant be a behavoiur or issue you are responsible for as a parent, can it? It keeps psychaitrists and drug companies in business, and dont underestimate how financially gainful such expanding diagnosis' can be to such large pharmacutical companies who have a clear vested interest in expandign medical explanations for all behaviour and then masquerading as having a cure. Right now in the US in relation to children the effeort is to sell the idea of "pre-psychosis" in kids being possible to identify, Jeeze talk about George Orwell and his book entitled 1984, its all happening if you look at it from a critical perspective. It is all happening, I see it and agree with you 100% Felix.
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Post by rayozz on Feb 7, 2012 23:46:33 GMT -6
Felix, Bustamante was put on Prozac after a suicide attempt in 2007. The dose was doubled 2 weeks before she killed Elizabeth. The defense produced experts that said this could have caused her murderous behaviour. The prosecution produced experts that said the opposite.
Sentencing is tomorrow.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 8, 2012 1:35:24 GMT -6
Felix, Bustamante was put on Prozac after a suicide attempt in 2007. The dose was doubled 2 weeks before she killed Elizabeth. The defense produced experts that said this could have caused her murderous behaviour. The prosecution produced experts that said the opposite. Sentencing is tomorrow. I took SSRIs between 2005 and 2006. I was pretty loopy and went through a few phases of hysteria. I also lost a number of friends and bizarrely took up self mutilation as a hobby. I also gained about 55kgs. I just stopped taking the drugs. I did suffer from depression. I needed a friend not drugs.
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Post by Felix2 on Feb 8, 2012 4:40:37 GMT -6
Felix, Bustamante was put on Prozac after a suicide attempt in 2007. The dose was doubled 2 weeks before she killed Elizabeth. The defense produced experts that said this could have caused her murderous behaviour. The prosecution produced experts that said the opposite. Sentencing is tomorrow. Prozac? And they argue that led to her murderous behaviour, like heck it did. Its also documented that her behaviour was the was it was (albeit she had not killed) but her anti social side was long odcumented from an early age, long before that medication came into play. I wonder if the evil little scrote thought that because she was now on przac she might have some "top cover" if she took her behaviour to the next level and began acting out her fantasies?
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Post by Deleted on Feb 8, 2012 5:53:30 GMT -6
Felix, Bustamante was put on Prozac after a suicide attempt in 2007. The dose was doubled 2 weeks before she killed Elizabeth. The defense produced experts that said this could have caused her murderous behaviour. The prosecution produced experts that said the opposite. Sentencing is tomorrow. Prozac? And they argue that led to her murderous behaviour, like heck it did. Its also documented that her behaviour was the was it was (albeit she had not killed) but her anti social side was long odcumented from an early age, long before that medication came into play. I wonder if the evil little scrote thought that because she was now on przac she might have some "top cover" if she took her behaviour to the next level and began acting out her fantasies? I generally resent people who use depression as an excuse to commit serious crime. It tells society that people with depression should all be treated as potentially dangerous
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Post by whitediamonds on Feb 8, 2012 9:33:06 GMT -6
Prozac? And they argue that led to her murderous behaviour, like heck it did. Its also documented that her behaviour was the was it was (albeit she had not killed) but her anti social side was long odcumented from an early age, long before that medication came into play. I wonder if the evil little scrote thought that because she was now on przac she might have some "top cover" if she took her behaviour to the next level and began acting out her fantasies? I generally resent people who use depression as an excuse to commit serious crime. It tells society that people with depression should all be treated as potentially dangerous The one time I was depressed when lost so many I loved, heck I had to push myself to walk to the end of the driveway to get the mail, felt like an extreme effort. Depressed people are only a danger to themselves from my past experience back then.
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Post by Californian on Feb 8, 2012 10:34:47 GMT -6
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Post by whitediamonds on Feb 8, 2012 11:37:32 GMT -6
Fifteen yrs old or not when she murdered, she is clearly a psychopath, No meds nor rehabilitation will make her less dangerous ever ....
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Post by Felix2 on Feb 8, 2012 12:51:30 GMT -6
Prozac? And they argue that led to her murderous behaviour, like heck it did. Its also documented that her behaviour was the was it was (albeit she had not killed) but her anti social side was long odcumented from an early age, long before that medication came into play. I wonder if the evil little scrote thought that because she was now on przac she might have some "top cover" if she took her behaviour to the next level and began acting out her fantasies? And not just depression, people with more serious mental illnesses such as schizophrenia get a back rep too, with the exception of those with command hallucinations and the like, the vast majority just want to live their lives normally.
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Post by reapwysow on Feb 8, 2012 12:55:29 GMT -6
She got life, with the possibility of parole.
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Post by Donnie on Feb 8, 2012 13:07:37 GMT -6
She got life, with the possibility of parole. When she is paroled she will kill again; more carefully.
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Leah
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Death penalty is necessary
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Post by Leah on Feb 8, 2012 15:30:54 GMT -6
She got life, with the possibility of parole. When she is paroled she will kill again; more carefully. If she got LWOP, it had better be a "true" LWOP with no appeals. Then she can't possibly be paroled or get an early release.
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Leah
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Death penalty is necessary
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Post by Leah on Feb 8, 2012 15:34:17 GMT -6
Felix, Bustamante was put on Prozac after a suicide attempt in 2007. The dose was doubled 2 weeks before she killed Elizabeth. The defense produced experts that said this could have caused her murderous behaviour. The prosecution produced experts that said the opposite. Sentencing is tomorrow. I took SSRIs between 2005 and 2006. I was pretty loopy and went through a few phases of hysteria. I also lost a number of friends and bizarrely took up self mutilation as a hobby. I also gained about 55kgs. I just stopped taking the drugs. I did suffer from depression. I needed a friend not drugs. After my Aunt died of stomach cancer in the year 2000, I got depressed and ended up taking Prozac and Lorazapam. It helped me a great deal. It does help many people, but some meds are better for others. I think it is genetic makeup.
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Post by rayozz on Feb 9, 2012 2:18:19 GMT -6
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Post by reapwysow on Feb 9, 2012 22:53:47 GMT -6
So it's possible she can go home. Unfortunatly , it will never be possible for the 9 year olds mother to ever see her daughter again.
Hell yes....justice.
you don't need to give anyone more or less than what they have done. Justice means equal. forever , for forever. How hard is that ti fathom.
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Post by Donnie on Feb 11, 2012 6:37:42 GMT -6
"Under Missouri guidelines, Bustamante would have to serve 35 years and five months in prison before she is eligible for parole, said Department of Corrections spokesman Chris Cline. It's also possible that the more than two years Bustamante spent in jail while awaiting her sentencing could be counted toward that time." I am sure that Chris Cline was being honest when he made the above statement. However, neither he nor anyone else in today's government can control the future. So today she will not be eligible for parole for 35 years and five months. However, the controlling law could be changed next year or the governor could pardon her in a few years.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 11, 2012 23:43:30 GMT -6
"She just made a mistake", " She deserves a second chance", "Shes just a kid". This bleeding heart bulls**t makes me sick. They seriously mean to say that a 15 year old is not aware that killing innocent people is wrong?! I would think when her victim was crying out for her life she would figure it out. She is not a kid and she isn't even a human. She is a monster! Monsters like this are the very reason we have the death penalty. And wasnt her victim "just a kid" at 9 years old?
Why the f*@k should this animal get a second chance if their victim doesnt get a second chance to live? By giving her a second chance you are slapping that poor victim's family in the face. Murderers should NEVER get a second chance. I dont care how much help she would get. She WILL kill again if we give her a chance to. Every murdering POS who has ever gotten a second chance has killed again. Ted Bundy escaped and killed again and Maurice Clemmons was pardoned and killed 4 police officers.
She cannot be rehabilitated. You cant rehabilitate a fighting pit bull. She is already killing innocent people at only 15 years old. The way I see it she is getting a head start. She will be the next Ted Bundy if we give her a chance (which they will). Her victim was just a little child! She will never get a second chance to live her life, so why should this animal get one?
I don't care how old you are. You violate someone's right to live you forfiet yours. At that age I knew killing innocent people was wrong and so did every other 15 year old I knew. I would have no problem with having the needle stuck in her. She threw her own life away when she decided to torture an innocent child to death.
Just my opinion.
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Post by The Tipsy Broker on Feb 12, 2012 4:40:56 GMT -6
"She just made a mistake", " She deserves a second chance", "Shes just a kid". This bleeding heart bulls**t makes me sick. They seriously mean to say that a 15 year old is not aware that killing innocent people is wrong?! I would think when her victim was crying out for her life she would figure it out. She is not a kid and she isn't even a human. She is a monster! Monsters like this are the very reason we have the death penalty. And wasnt her victim "just a kid" at 9 years old? Why the f*@k should this animal get a second chance if their victim doesnt get a second chance to live? By giving her a second chance you are slapping that poor victim's family in the face. Murderers should NEVER get a second chance. I dont care how much help she would get. She WILL kill again if we give her a chance to. Every murdering POS who has ever gotten a second chance has killed again. Ted Bundy escaped and killed again and Maurice Clemmons was pardoned and killed 4 police officers. She cannot be rehabilitated. You cant rehabilitate a fighting pit bull. She is already killing innocent people at only 15 years old. The way I see it she is getting a head start. She will be the next Ted Bundy if we give her a chance (which they will). Her victim was just a little child! She will never get a second chance to live her life, so why should this animal get one? I don't care how old you are. You violate someone's right to live you forfiet yours. At that age I knew killing innocent people was wrong and so did every other 15 year old I knew. I would have no problem with having the needle stuck in her. She threw her own life away when she decided to torture an innocent child to death. Just my opinion. Well said. Im of the opinion that murderers don't deserve a second chance, even if they go on to discover penicilin (discovered but you get the gist). Surely the victims LIFE taken is worth the death sentence? Welcome to the board
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Post by Donnie on Feb 12, 2012 9:14:48 GMT -6
Every murdering POS who has ever gotten a second chance has killed again. Ted Bundy escaped and killed again and Maurice Clemmons was pardoned and killed 4 police officers. Although I agree with most of what you wrote, every murdering POS does not kill again. Many do and they have killed hundreds of new victims after their first murder conviction. Unfortunately we do not know which ones will kill (or have killed) again. However, Bustamante is almost certain to kill again.
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Post by reapwysow on Feb 12, 2012 12:56:45 GMT -6
"She just made a mistake", " She deserves a second chance", "Shes just a kid". This bleeding heart bulls**t makes me sick. They seriously mean to say that a 15 year old is not aware that killing innocent people is wrong?! I would think when her victim was crying out for her life she would figure it out. She is not a kid and she isn't even a human. She is a monster! Monsters like this are the very reason we have the death penalty. And wasnt her victim "just a kid" at 9 years old? Why the f*@k should this animal get a second chance if their victim doesnt get a second chance to live? By giving her a second chance you are slapping that poor victim's family in the face. Murderers should NEVER get a second chance. I dont care how much help she would get. She WILL kill again if we give her a chance to. Every murdering POS who has ever gotten a second chance has killed again. Ted Bundy escaped and killed again and Maurice Clemmons was pardoned and killed 4 police officers. She cannot be rehabilitated. You cant rehabilitate a fighting pit bull. She is already killing innocent people at only 15 years old. The way I see it she is getting a head start. She will be the next Ted Bundy if we give her a chance (which they will). Her victim was just a little child! She will never get a second chance to live her life, so why should this animal get one? I don't care how old you are. You violate someone's right to live you forfiet yours. At that age I knew killing innocent people was wrong and so did every other 15 year old I knew. I would have no problem with having the needle stuck in her. She threw her own life away when she decided to torture an innocent child to death. Just my opinion. So the killing of innocent people , no matter the cirumstance should be punishable by death? Is that your stance?
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Post by Deleted on Feb 19, 2012 12:14:27 GMT -6
As an addition to my original response I also understand The Green River Killer, Gary Rigway tried to stab a 6 year old to death when he was 16 "just to see what it was like". Coincidence?
And is it just me or does this girl have Aileen Wournos's eyes?
"So the killing of innocent people , no matter the cirumstance should be punishable by death? Is that your stance?"
Well when you when you purposly plan out the murder, dig the graves and have all the time in the world for your consience to kick in and not even realize what you had done when it was over and even brag about it, then hell yes. That is first degree murder. Circumstances such as that are punishable by death in most states. I don't mean as in an accident or a fit of rage. I should have clarified that.
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Post by DeadElvis on Feb 19, 2012 12:36:39 GMT -6
As an addition to my original response I also understand The Green River Killer, Gary Rigway tried to stab a 6 year old to death when he was 16 "just to see what it was like". Coincidence? And is it just me or does this girl have Aileen Wournos's eyes? "So the killing of innocent people , no matter the cirumstance should be punishable by death? Is that your stance?" Well when you when you purposly plan out the murder, dig the graves and have all the time in the world for your consience to kick in and not even realize what you had done when it was over and even brag about it, then hell yes. That is first degree murder. Circumstances such as that are punishable by death in most states. I don't mean as in an accident or a fit of rage. I should have clarified that. Agree. What is with the correlation between mental illness and murder? Some seem to think that mental illness causes one to murder. Thousands of mentally ill folks in the US prove otherwise. Fortunate for us that the vast majority of mentally ill folks do not commit murder. The vast majority of non-mentally ill folks do not commit murder either. I would be curious to read the opinion of Felix on this question. Does being mentally make one more likely to commit murder? If so are all murderers mentally ill to some degree? Personally, I fail to see why mental illness is used as an excuse for murderous behavior. Is there a causal relationship?
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