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Post by whitediamonds on Feb 20, 2018 21:27:27 GMT -6
Mental issues are none of the cops business? I am afraid not. There is no constitutional way for the cops to arrest someone simply for being mentally ill. You can hoot and holler and scream to the moon that it just isn't fair, but that doesn't mean it isn't true. If you can give me a workable way to spot a rampage killer in advance, then we can talk about notifying people. Appears many saw signs & ignored it, until one forwarded his remark ( I want to be a profession school shooter) That was not addressed by the FBI. No you cannot arrest one for being mentally off , if the warning signs are there it is legal to investigate & should be. So, your solution is still do nothing at all. I disagree. No different than if a neighbor feels something does not seem right, like the children only seen at night, home schooled something seems off. One of those girls finally escaped to find help. No harm to investigate. Better safe than sorry. This dude had a history of violence. Even towards animals which in itself has shown over & over humans are next. We even have begun animal abuse hot lines, one phone number soon, to protect, so why not for humans?? We have laws on top of laws which are not being enforced. That needs changed.
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Post by bernard on Feb 21, 2018 0:13:50 GMT -6
So, your solution is still do nothing at all. "Maybe we could prevent school shootings by hanging chicken entrails from the rooftops and shouting bible quotes to ward away the devil." "Nah. That ain't gonna work." "So your solution is to do nothing at all?"
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Post by hawg on Feb 21, 2018 11:45:28 GMT -6
Mental issues are none of the cops business? I am afraid not. There is no constitutional way for the cops to arrest someone simply for being mentally ill. You can hoot and holler and scream to the moon that it just isn't fair, but that doesn't mean it isn't true. If you can give me a workable way to spot a rampage killer in advance, then we can talk about notifying people. if you are using the word arrest in conjunction with a criminal charge your're right, you can't "arrest" someone for mental illness. but cops CAN make involuntary committments to a mental facility for 24 to 72 hours. at such time a doctors assessment can be made and it usually involves a court hearing to make a determination of continued treatment and eventually a court adjudication of mental stability. but the whole purpose of a NICS check is to have a database of disqualifying factors to purchase a gun. including the above, but it's not readily available. and you're right we'll likely never be able to predetermine the guy who is fine one day and off his rocker the next. isn't that what they are finding out about the vegas shooter?
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Post by hawg on Feb 21, 2018 11:57:20 GMT -6
I am afraid not. There is no constitutional way for the cops to arrest someone simply for being mentally ill. You can hoot and holler and scream to the moon that it just isn't fair, but that doesn't mean it isn't true. If you can give me a workable way to spot a rampage killer in advance, then we can talk about notifying people. Appears many saw signs & ignored it, until one forwarded his remark ( I want to be a profession school shooter) That was not addressed by the FBI. No you cannot arrest one for being mentally off , if the warning signs are there it is legal to investigate & should be. So, your solution is still do nothing at all. I disagree. No different than if a neighbor feels something does not seem right, like the children only seen at night, home schooled something seems off. One of those girls finally escaped to find help. No harm to investigate. Better safe than sorry. This dude had a history of violence. Even towards animals which in itself has shown over & over humans are next. We even have begun animal abuse hot lines, one phone number soon, to protect, so why not for humans?? We have laws on top of laws which are not being enforced. That needs changed. you make a point about investigating signs. if of course someone has the time and manpower to peruse every off the the cuff stupid thing kids say. but for all the complaints about the FBI in this matter, what we're they going to do? shoot him? lock him up for life? sure, maybe seize his gun but under what due process? in all likelyhood we are NOT even going to execute this kid for actually killing 17 people, we're sure as hell not going to do much to him for making stupid facebook postings. certainly a dilemma. but one thing is for sure, screwing with my rights won't fix the problem. why do we post guards at virtually everywhere else but not for our children?
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Post by whitediamonds on Feb 21, 2018 13:26:44 GMT -6
Appears many saw signs & ignored it, until one forwarded his remark ( I want to be a profession school shooter) That was not addressed by the FBI. No you cannot arrest one for being mentally off , if the warning signs are there it is legal to investigate & should be. So, your solution is still do nothing at all. I disagree. No different than if a neighbor feels something does not seem right, like the children only seen at night, home schooled something seems off. One of those girls finally escaped to find help. No harm to investigate. Better safe than sorry. This dude had a history of violence. Even towards animals which in itself has shown over & over humans are next. We even have begun animal abuse hot lines, one phone number soon, to protect, so why not for humans?? We have laws on top of laws which are not being enforced. That needs changed. you make a point about investigating signs. if of course someone has the time and manpower to peruse every off the the cuff stupid thing kids say. but for all the complaints about the FBI in this matter, what we're they going to do? shoot him? lock him up for life? sure, maybe seize his gun but under what due process? in all likelyhood we are NOT even going to execute this kid for actually killing 17 people, we're sure as hell not going to do much to him for making stupid facebook postings. certainly a dilemma. but one thing is for sure, screwing with my rights won't fix the problem. why do we post guards at virtually everywhere else but not for our children? He will not be executed. A young person saying I what to be a professional school shooter is cause to investigate. Since this calls etc threats have been made here at schools, they were found & arrested as it should be. In another words it will be hard to legally get a gun. Even though other methods are out there not just a gun. Schools should be armed, principle, some teachers, some schools here they are armed. Work places etc...... I will say this again it is the young killing the young in schools. Do these kids have any insight or thoughts to share on that???
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Post by hawg on Feb 21, 2018 13:35:52 GMT -6
good question. in most cases the shooter is killed with no reason obtained. perhaps this kid will one day say but it won't be for awhile, his attornys will not allow him to say anything .
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Post by bernard on Feb 21, 2018 18:33:58 GMT -6
but the whole purpose of a NICS check is to have a database of disqualifying factors to purchase a gun. including the above, but it's not readily available. I can't imagine a system based on background checks doing a lot of good. Maybe it would do a little. Perhaps we should greatly increase the available mental healthcare. Surely people with schizophrenia should be in hospitals. Children with hostility and antisocial personalities should be taught self-management skills from age 7, not left to become hateful loners harboring revenge fantasies over the pettiest of imagined grievances until they finally boil over at 16. SSRIs and other powerful drugs should be prescribed to teenagers and mentally unstable people only with blanket medical supervision.
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Post by hawg on Feb 21, 2018 20:49:24 GMT -6
but the whole purpose of a NICS check is to have a database of disqualifying factors to purchase a gun. including the above, but it's not readily available. I can't imagine a system based on background checks doing a lot of good. Maybe it would do a little. Perhaps we should greatly increase the available mental healthcare. Surely people with schizophrenia should be in hospitals. Children with hostility and antisocial personalities should be taught self-management skills from age 7, not left to become hateful loners harboring revenge fantasies over the pettiest of imagined grievances until they finally boil over at 16. SSRIs and other powerful drugs should be prescribed to teenagers and mentally unstable people only with blanket medical supervision. the human species, if it was easy anybody could be one. waddya do?
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Post by bernard on Feb 22, 2018 11:43:06 GMT -6
I can't imagine a system based on background checks doing a lot of good. Maybe it would do a little. Perhaps we should greatly increase the available mental healthcare. Surely people with schizophrenia should be in hospitals. Children with hostility and antisocial personalities should be taught self-management skills from age 7, not left to become hateful loners harboring revenge fantasies over the pettiest of imagined grievances until they finally boil over at 16. SSRIs and other powerful drugs should be prescribed to teenagers and mentally unstable people only with blanket medical supervision. the human species, if it was easy anybody could be one. waddya do? Maybe folks should start thinking about what compromises they're willing to make, instead of asking what compromises the people down the street can make.
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Post by hawg on Feb 22, 2018 11:57:57 GMT -6
Absolutely correct. Won't happen though, it's not in our genes.
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