|
Post by whitediamonds on Sept 4, 2013 17:06:21 GMT -6
Snowden, I see him as a whistleblower. In the public's interest I feel we need the protection for individual privacy. Whistleblowers prove if those in power can do it, they can do it also.
|
|
|
Post by starbux on Sept 4, 2013 18:39:14 GMT -6
Snowden, I see him as a whistleblower. In the public's interest I feel we need the protection for individual privacy. Whistleblowers prove if those in power can do it, they can do it also. I initially agreed, however he has crossed the line from simply whistle blowing. Now he has released some of our combat intelegence. Once he did that he is now a traitor.
|
|
|
Post by charon on Sept 4, 2013 23:37:54 GMT -6
Who among you honestly believes that the U.S. Govt. would make this public if they had a choice? The public has a right to know when their government screws up, which they have in this case. He might be a traitor to the U.S., but he should be a hero to the rest of the world. And as long as his revelations hasn't caused any deaths, he can hardly be said to have damaged anything else than the U.S. reputation. And Matt - the Nobel Peace price has never been awarded by the Swedes; it has always been the domain of the Nobel Institute in Oslo. You might want to check your sources I was tempted to tell you to shut up, but that would just be rude. So I won't do it, ok? Have a nice day.
|
|
|
Post by charon on Sept 4, 2013 23:40:33 GMT -6
Snowden, I see him as a whistleblower. In the public's interest I feel we need the protection for individual privacy. Whistleblowers prove if those in power can do it, they can do it also. I initially agreed, however he has crossed the line from simply whistle blowing. Now he has released some of our combat intelegence. Once he did that he is now a traitor. He's so screwed that he might as well go big. It would make no difference and that makes him super dangerous. Walking corpse.
|
|
nate
Old Hand
momento mori.
Posts: 544
|
Post by nate on Sept 5, 2013 9:25:11 GMT -6
Peace Prize!
|
|
|
Post by whitediamonds on Sept 5, 2013 17:51:54 GMT -6
I initially agreed, however he has crossed the line from simply whistle blowing. Now he has released some of our combat intelegence. Once he did that he is now a traitor. He's so screwed that he might as well go big. It would make no difference and that makes him super dangerous. Walking corpse. I think Obama is the super dangerous one to be concerned about, Snowden is side show.
|
|
|
Post by fuglyville on Sept 5, 2013 18:27:16 GMT -6
He's so screwed that he might as well go big. It would make no difference and that makes him super dangerous. Walking corpse. I think Obama is the super dangerous one to be concerned about, Snowden is side show. The only thing scary about Obama is that he's too conservative. Otherwise, he seems like a decent fellow - at least compared to his predecessor and his cabinet, who were(with all due respect) an utter disaster.
|
|
|
Post by oslooskar on Sept 6, 2013 0:08:15 GMT -6
The only thing scary about Obama is that he's too conservative. Otherwise, he seems like a decent fellow You must live in a broom closet because you have absolutely no idea what you’re talking about. Your pal Obama signed the “National Defense Authorization Act” and thereby gave the military the power to detain American citizens indefinitely, without charge, or trial, for merely being under suspicion of having ties to terrorists. As for Obama being a conservative; you’re dreaming because no real conservative would ever so blatantly trample on the Constitutional Rights of the citizenry.
|
|
|
Post by charon on Sept 6, 2013 0:15:09 GMT -6
The only thing scary about Obama is that he's too conservative. Otherwise, he seems like a decent fellow You must live in a broom closet because you have absolutely no idea what you’re talking about. Your pal Obama signed the “National Defense Authorization Act” and thereby gave the military the power to detain American citizens indefinitely, without charge, or trial, for merely being under suspicion of having ties to terrorists. As for Obama being a conservative; you’re dreaming because no real conservative would ever so blatantly trample on the Constitutional Rights of the citizenry. Well said.
|
|
|
Post by fuglyville on Sept 6, 2013 5:16:19 GMT -6
You must live in a broom closet because you have absolutely no idea what you’re talking about. Your pal Obama signed the “National Defense Authorization Act” and thereby gave the military the power to detain American citizens indefinitely, without charge, or trial, for merely being under suspicion of having ties to terrorists. As for Obama being a conservative; you’re dreaming because no real conservative would ever so blatantly trample on the Constitutional Rights of the citizenry. Well said. Guantanamo Bay has detained people vaguely suspected of possibly being involved in terrorist acts for years. The fact that they're foreigners doesn't make this any less of a human rights disaster. To say that no conservative would do such a thing is therefore pure and utter *bullcrap*.
|
|
|
Post by whitediamonds on Sept 6, 2013 8:59:16 GMT -6
I think Obama is the super dangerous one to be concerned about, Snowden is side show. The only thing scary about Obama is that he's too conservative. Otherwise, he seems like a decent fellow - Guess obama is too conservative , as well as would seem like a good fellow to you. Your twins. Please take him.
|
|
|
Post by oslooskar on Sept 6, 2013 13:27:58 GMT -6
Guantanamo Bay has detained people vaguely suspected of possibly being involved in terrorist acts for years. GOOD GRIEF! What, exactly, does that have to do with Obama signing the National Defense Authorization Act? The fact that they're foreigners doesn't make this any less of a human rights disaster. I agree, but, once again, what does that have to do with the fact that your pal Obama knowingly signed a document that he knew to be unconstitutional? To say that no conservative would do such a thing is therefore pure and utter *bullcrap*. On the contrary, to state otherwise would be pure horse***t. Look up the word “conservative”.
|
|
|
Post by Matt on Sept 6, 2013 16:44:23 GMT -6
And Matt - the Nobel Peace price has never been awarded by the Swedes; it has always been the domain of the Nobel Institute in Oslo. You might want to check your sources It doesn't matter who awards the prize. It is who nominates that matters. For example, in physics: www.nobelprize.org/nomination/physics/
|
|
|
Post by fuglyville on Sept 6, 2013 17:10:40 GMT -6
And Matt - the Nobel Peace price has never been awarded by the Swedes; it has always been the domain of the Nobel Institute in Oslo. You might want to check your sources It doesn't matter who awards the prize. It is who nominates that matters. For example, in physics: www.nobelprize.org/nomination/physics/That's physics, not The Peace Prize. There is a difference, and(being a grown-up) you should check these things out before making unfounded statements.
|
|
|
Post by starbux on Sept 6, 2013 17:21:24 GMT -6
I nominate Fugly ha ha LOl Since he figured out how to discover most retarded ideas in the cosmos. All serious though, I had a brilliant physics professor once who was submitted for work he did in practical physics that he did at las Alamos labs. He didn't make it through the initial committee. Apparently it is a very political process of being nominated by the right people and the country of origin. Apparently a lot of scientist that work with certain US labs are blackballed because the assumption is that they are working on weapons.
|
|
|
Post by starbux on Sept 6, 2013 17:24:37 GMT -6
That's physics, not The Peace Prize. There is a difference, and(being a grown-up) you should check these things out before making unfounded statements. He was using it as an example you moron. Stfu, no one gives two shots what you think anyway. Besides the Nobel committee has stated that they don't consider anyone for the prize from petitions from outside sources. Although there probably some some luney academic, ie a lab monkey that escaped and is as a professor that will probably nominate him and inmate manning anyway. I bet they regret giving it to Obama. The prize is crock of sht anyway.
|
|
|
Post by Matt on Sept 6, 2013 17:42:50 GMT -6
That's physics, not The Peace Prize. There is a difference, and(being a grown-up) you should check these things out before making unfounded statements.[/quote] You're right. I stand corrected. The Peace Prize is specifically the purview of the Norwegian Nobel Committee, which is quite a different thing than the academic prizes, whose processes are dominated by Swedish academics. I should have been more thoughtful in my post. Thanks for pointing it out.
|
|
|
Post by honeyroastedpeanut on Sept 6, 2013 18:04:33 GMT -6
You're right. I stand corrected. The Peace Prize is specifically the purview of the Norwegian Nobel Committee, which is quite a different thing than the academic prizes, whose processes are dominated by Swedish academics. I should have been more thoughtful in my post. Thanks for pointing it out. It's posts like this why you're missed around here, Matt. It's always a fair and civilized debate with you, not some stubborn fight about who's right and who's wrong. I can't claim to be very active here these days myself, though. The place has become less crowded and less keen to debate it seems.
|
|
|
Post by Matt on Sept 7, 2013 10:50:10 GMT -6
Cheers, Chris. Most of what we debate around here is completely driven by subjective opinion: that is up to each individual to make their case. But facts used to substantiate those positions are simple enough to prove and need to be acknowledged.
And yes, I hear you about being active here. I've just been too busy to come here much, although I still enjoy it and try to drop in when I can!
|
|
nate
Old Hand
momento mori.
Posts: 544
|
Post by nate on Sept 9, 2013 9:16:53 GMT -6
A war with Syria would be a bad mistake right now, not to mention costly.
|
|
|
Post by starbux on Sept 9, 2013 13:28:40 GMT -6
A war with Syria would be a bad mistake right now, not to mention costly. I think we all agree. There is a whole discussion on the off topic section of the forum
|
|
|
Post by eu.ro on Sept 11, 2013 6:53:52 GMT -6
Discuss The information Snowden shared with us actually reveal that the United States of America have finally reached moral bankruptcy. The NSA (National Socialism Agency) is the world's biggest and most dangerous axis-of-evil member. Stalin would be proud of you.
|
|
|
Post by starbux on Sept 11, 2013 12:46:49 GMT -6
Discuss The information Snowden shared with us actually reveal that the United States of America have finally reached moral bankruptcy. The NSA (National Socialism Agency) is the world's biggest and most dangerous axis-of-evil member. Stalin would be proud of you. You better take a close look at China and what they do. They have an active cyber program where just as part of their training curriculum involves hacking into random websites around the world just for training value. To make comment is little off base. I am not excusing the NSA's spying on our own citizens, however we were duped into the hysteria after a couple of tiny little insignificant buildings went down and that little tiny incident of a real small smacking the side of the pentagon. I suppose that its no big deal that those events occurred anyway. Like if the muzlims decided to tear down oh that lawn ornament in Paris, I am sure Europe would have no problem with that would they. On serious note, I don't think they actively were trying screw all of the citizens over. I think people got a little over-zealous. Our government was demanding that we figure who is going to do future attacks on us and they crossed the line. Do I excuse their actions for violating a 200 year old document? No, but these people are just government workers trying to a job that congress demanded them to do. Where I think the government crossed the line was when they prosecuted Qualcom CEO for insider trading after he refused to get involved in these programs. Which is funny, if people actually paid more attention to the world around them they would realize that this was happening underneath our noses in plain sight, with companies being strong armed to do this. The patriot act spelled out these actions were leagal. Congress passed it, if they didn't they would not win the election next time around because the opponent would say "The support terrorists." That's what the white house told congress back then that if they did not support the bill that was crafted by Cheney and Rumsfeld then they "Must be for the terrorists or they aren't' doing there part in Keepin Merika Safe." The current administration has no problem keeping them alive either. So it is a lot more complicated then your 1 line conjecture.
|
|
|
Post by eu.ro on Sept 12, 2013 12:58:55 GMT -6
Neither the NSA nor any other US organization has the right to monitor European data. Period. The US have violated European laws. It's as simple as that. No matter what stale justifications you might have.
You complain about China? You criticize Russia? Where have you been when Rumsfeld faked the evidence?
|
|
|
Post by starbux on Sept 12, 2013 21:32:44 GMT -6
Neither the NSA nor any other US organization has the right to monitor European data. Period. The US have violated European laws. It's as simple as that. No matter what stale justifications you might have. You complain about China? You criticize Russia? Where have you been when Rumsfeld faked the evidence? We are not talking about Rummie fck him! We can do what ever we want to anything that enters our country. Technically the program that Snowden ousted would be 100% legal except for fact it violated the American rights on our own soil. Besides my europe robust protections on privacy as we do in the US. Don't talk to me about privacy. Custom official's in every nation around the planet open up packages from international shipments all of the time. Seeing what kind of bullsht is being transmitted from countries around world into ours yeah we have right to know. If your country is harboring Mohamad Allah Akbar and he is trying another terrorist attack here you bet we will be monitoring.
|
|
Tim S
Old Hand
Posts: 567
|
Post by Tim S on Oct 8, 2013 8:13:51 GMT -6
Edited because I did not read all the posts.
|
|
|
Post by Matt on Oct 8, 2013 13:55:16 GMT -6
I'm very confident that the NSA has helped to prevent attacks against the US (and its allies). Increased domestic surveillance seems to be a small price to pay for greater security. At least that's how I feel. But then I've got nothing to hide.
|
|
|
Post by ltdc on Oct 8, 2013 16:37:22 GMT -6
I'm very confident that the NSA has helped to prevent attacks against the US (and its allies). Increased domestic surveillance seems to be a small price to pay for greater security. At least that's how I feel. But then I've got nothing to hide. we've all got "something' to hide
|
|