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Post by Deleted on Sept 21, 2009 12:38:32 GMT -6
I don't see it that way. Broom, by his own admission, said he deliberately dehydrated himself so his executioners would have a much harder time finding a vein in which the shunts would hold. With this happening in my state and all , I have read several articles concerning this execution attempt and never read anything that said he intentionally dehydrated himself . I have actually read the opposite . Do you have any links to the articles that I may of missed that said this ? Thanks in advance . Look people - let's clear this up right now.. Voluntary or involuntary dehydration DOES NOT, CANNOT, and WILL NOT cause ones veins to disappear or collapse... Period... The notion that Broom intentionally dehydrated himself in order to thwart the authorities attempts to insert the IV catheter during his own execution is preposterous... In addition to all the other medical issues dehydration causes, it can and often does lead to a decrease in plasma volume - but NOT to vascular destruction or venous structural compromise. Venous collapse is caused by trauma, ie., drug use or a legitimate patient that has consistent venous perforation over an extended period of time. NOT by dehydration..
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Post by Grey on Sept 21, 2009 14:46:04 GMT -6
I was reading some of the news articles about Broom and they have headlines like "botched execution" and "man survives execution."
Now, my question/point is how was it botched? how did he survive the execution when he wasn't given anything that would have killed him? The correct title should be "Broom fails prep for execution" or "execution haulted due to lack of veins"
by no means was this a botched execution . . . when an execution hadn't occured.
The only one who has the proper title is the case Erick posted: that man did survive his first execution attempt.
Anyway, some of you guys have probably already thought of this but I had to share because it irks me.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 21, 2009 14:55:43 GMT -6
Introduce beheading. It is the most loving way to execute, and it gets the job done quickly. The ultimate cutdown Indeed - this is how they do a venous cutdown in Riyahd, Saudi Arabia:
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Post by rick4404 on Sept 21, 2009 15:31:43 GMT -6
I don't see it that way. Broom, by his own admission, said he deliberately dehydrated himself so his executioners would have a much harder time finding a vein in which the shunts would hold. With this happening in my state and all , I have read several articles concerning this execution attempt and never read anything that said he intentionally dehydrated himself . I have actually read the opposite . Do you have any links to the articles that I may of missed that said this ? Thanks in advance . Broom admitted to dehydrating himself. Here are his comments from a prisontalk.com thread. You'll want to check this out because I'm told these kinds of comments get taken down rather quickly: tinyurl.com/n8nmqp
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Post by brumsongs on Sept 21, 2009 15:35:55 GMT -6
With this happening in my state and all , I have read several articles concerning this execution attempt and never read anything that said he intentionally dehydrated himself . I have actually read the opposite . Do you have any links to the articles that I may of missed that said this ? Thanks in advance . Broom admitted to dehydrating himself. Here are his comments from a prisontalk.com thread. You'll want to check this out because I'm told these kinds of comments get taken down rather quickly: tinyurl.com/n8nmqpif that was written by a black man then I'm Al Jolson
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Post by Kay on Sept 21, 2009 16:06:20 GMT -6
With this happening in my state and all , I have read several articles concerning this execution attempt and never read anything that said he intentionally dehydrated himself . I have actually read the opposite . Do you have any links to the articles that I may of missed that said this ? Thanks in advance . Broom admitted to dehydrating himself. Here are his comments from a prisontalk.com thread. You'll want to check this out because I'm told these kinds of comments get taken down rather quickly: tinyurl.com/n8nmqpAnd we believe absolutely, everything, that's said by pen pals and death row groupies at Prison Talk, right?
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Post by Grey on Sept 21, 2009 16:11:34 GMT -6
With this happening in my state and all , I have read several articles concerning this execution attempt and never read anything that said he intentionally dehydrated himself . I have actually read the opposite . Do you have any links to the articles that I may of missed that said this ? Thanks in advance . Broom admitted to dehydrating himself. Here are his comments from a prisontalk.com thread. You'll want to check this out because I'm told these kinds of comments get taken down rather quickly: tinyurl.com/n8nmqpI honestly don't see how this statment whether true or false would help the anti movement. If he did dehydrate himself he would be obstructing justice which would result in a second attempt of his execution. If he did not dehydrate himslef then he has bad veins due to IV drug use. If he loses his appeal they are going to have to find a vein somehow.
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Post by brumsongs on Sept 21, 2009 16:20:44 GMT -6
Who said an anti put it there. As we said in the playground upon commenting about flatulence "he who smelt it dealt it." I'd look (very) close to home.
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Lady
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Post by Lady on Sept 21, 2009 17:19:24 GMT -6
With this happening in my state and all , I have read several articles concerning this execution attempt and never read anything that said he intentionally dehydrated himself . I have actually read the opposite . Do you have any links to the articles that I may of missed that said this ? Thanks in advance . Broom admitted to dehydrating himself. Here are his comments from a prisontalk.com thread. You'll want to check this out because I'm told these kinds of comments get taken down rather quickly: tinyurl.com/n8nmqpRick , no offense, but dude if we looked up the word gullible in the dictionary ,you picture would be right next to it Someone at the off2dr.com message board posted that as a joke . I don't exactly think of PTO as a legitimate news source .
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Post by whitediamonds on Sept 21, 2009 17:21:06 GMT -6
Broom admitted to dehydrating himself. Here are his comments from a prisontalk.com thread. You'll want to check this out because I'm told these kinds of comments get taken down rather quickly: tinyurl.com/n8nmqpRick , no offense, but dude if we looked up the word gullible in the dictionary ,you picture would be right next to it Someone at the off2dr.com message board posted that as a joke . I don't exactly think of PTO as a legitimate news source . Sorry Rick, I have too agree with Lady ;D
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Post by Grey on Sept 21, 2009 17:24:11 GMT -6
Who said an anti put it there. As we said in the playground upon commenting about flatulence "he who smelt it dealt it." I'd look (very) close to home. was it not taken from an prison talk fourm where the majority of posters are anti and prisoner supporters? either way, that comment about dehyrdation does not help wither side.
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Post by Californian on Sept 21, 2009 17:59:52 GMT -6
The physiology is a tad above my head. I note also that neither of the victim knew they were going to die, as a convict does. I find it hard to believe that a human experiences oxygen deprivation and doesn't realize it, whatever the method. And I also think, as some posters have stated above, that a new method is insanity. As propounded, such a new method would create a de facto (if not de jure) moratorium while the issue wends its way through our courts. No. We give them the best death we know how now. It is neither cruel nor unusual, and SCOTUS has approved it. Next.
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Post by Matt on Sept 21, 2009 18:04:20 GMT -6
No. We give them the best death we know how now. It is neither cruel nor unusual, and SCOTUS has approved it. I must be a simpleton, then, because I can't understand why these challenges to LI as C&U still continue. I thought SCOTUS already ruled.
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Post by Californian on Sept 21, 2009 18:17:44 GMT -6
Look people - let's clear this up right now.. Voluntary or involuntary dehydration DOES NOT, CANNOT, and WILL NOT cause ones veins to disappear or collapse... Period... The notion that Broom intentionally dehydrated himself in order to thwart the authorities attempts to insert the IV catheter during his own execution is preposterous... In addition to all the other medical issues dehydration causes, it can and often does lead to a decrease in plasma volume - but NOT to vascular destruction or venous structural compromise. Venous collapse is caused by trauma, ie., drug use or a legitimate patient that has consistent venous perforation over an extended period of time. NOT by dehydration.. Furthermore, he's been on death row forever, and I don't think he's had much access to illicit drugs used IV. Plenty of time for those veins to heal. And there's absolutely no reason not to do a cardiac stick. It causes no more pain than starting an IV and provides immediate access to circulation.
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Post by unkelremus on Sept 22, 2009 7:43:38 GMT -6
The Associated Press COLUMBUS, Ohio -- A condemned killer who faces an unprecedented second attempt at lethal injection is at least temporarily back on death row in Ohio.
Defense attorney Tim Sweeney said Monday that inmate Romell (roh-MELL') Broom was moved back to death row at the Ohio State Penitentiary in Youngstown on Sunday.
U.S. District Judge Gregory Frost has suspended another attempt to put Broom to death and plans a hearing next week on requests for a further delay.
Gov. Ted Strickland stopped Broom's execution last Tuesday after about two hours when executioners failed to find a usable vein.
Broom wept at one point during the procedure and later complained of the needle painfully poking bone and muscle.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 22, 2009 8:00:28 GMT -6
Look people - let's clear this up right now.. Voluntary or involuntary dehydration DOES NOT, CANNOT, and WILL NOT cause ones veins to disappear or collapse... Period... The notion that Broom intentionally dehydrated himself in order to thwart the authorities attempts to insert the IV catheter during his own execution is preposterous... In addition to all the other medical issues dehydration causes, it can and often does lead to a decrease in plasma volume - but NOT to vascular destruction or venous structural compromise. Venous collapse is caused by trauma, ie., drug use or a legitimate patient that has consistent venous perforation over an extended period of time. NOT by dehydration.. Furthermore, he's been on death row forever, and I don't think he's had much access to illicit drugs used IV. Plenty of time for those veins to heal. While I'm no vascular surgeon, it is my understanding that veins can indeed become so damaged from drug over use that they are no longer viable.. In such a case, the venous return is diverted to smaller local veins instead of the larger one such as the basilic vein. Over time, one can virtually destroy all of the veins in ones arm. As a result, drug users then have to seek out new locations in which to inject drugs as the previous site has become obsolete - perhaps the back of the hand, the feet, the lower legs, etc. In this case, Broom MUST have done just that because the alleged self-dehydration would have had NO effect on his venous access. Yes, it is unlikely that he has had access to drugs during his incarceration. My question is: during the pre-execution physical examination; why did they not take that opportunity to exactly identify the primary, secondary, and subsequent veins to be used; and incorporate those sites directly into the plan of attack? Instead they wheeled this scumbag in, and started poking around, like untrained, undisciplined morons...
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Post by Rev. Agave on Sept 22, 2009 11:00:36 GMT -6
They should have gone to the neck or groin. Both have been done before.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 22, 2009 11:59:28 GMT -6
They should have gone to the neck or groin. Both have been done before. Actually, they should have gone straight to the saphenous vein in the scumbags ankle... Two minutes tops, and the only discomfort he would feel is the local anesthetic injection(s)...
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Post by davebowman on Sept 23, 2009 1:25:06 GMT -6
The Associated Press COLUMBUS, Ohio -- A condemned killer who faces an unprecedented second attempt at lethal injection is at least temporarily back on death row in Ohio. Defense attorney Tim Sweeney said Monday that inmate Romell (roh-MELL') Broom was moved back to death row at the Ohio State Penitentiary in Youngstown on Sunday. U.S. District Judge Gregory Frost has suspended another attempt to put Broom to death and plans a hearing next week on requests for a further delay. Gov. Ted Strickland stopped Broom's execution last Tuesday after about two hours when executioners failed to find a usable vein. Broom wept at one point during the procedure and later complained of the needle painfully poking bone and muscle. This is no good news. It can take weeks or months before he gets another date.
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Post by john - uk on Sept 23, 2009 9:19:44 GMT -6
The Associated Press COLUMBUS, Ohio -- A condemned killer who faces an unprecedented second attempt at lethal injection is at least temporarily back on death row in Ohio. Defense attorney Tim Sweeney said Monday that inmate Romell (roh-MELL') Broom was moved back to death row at the Ohio State Penitentiary in Youngstown on Sunday. U.S. District Judge Gregory Frost has suspended another attempt to put Broom to death and plans a hearing next week on requests for a further delay. Gov. Ted Strickland stopped Broom's execution last Tuesday after about two hours when executioners failed to find a usable vein. Broom wept at one point during the procedure and later complained of the needle painfully poking bone and muscle. Will this affect other inmates with dates in Ohio, or is it just Broom?
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Post by Rev. Agave on Sept 23, 2009 9:43:34 GMT -6
They should have gone to the neck or groin. Both have been done before. Actually, they should have gone straight to the saphenous vein in the scumbags ankle... Two minutes tops, and the only discomfort he would feel is the local anesthetic injection(s)... I read yesterday on MSN that they did try to tap a vein in his legs. I am not sure if that is true, but it was on the MSN homepage. I know a lot of drug users inject in the ankle. I am sure if they gave the inmate a needle loaded with heroin he would manage to find a vein. On any account, the groin the way to go. Most drug users have never injected there, and it is a huge vein area. I mean, whenever you get a boner, the blood flows pretty rapidly to the *deleted*. Surely the could stick a needle there and inject the lethal poison. I know at least one other state has done it before. I realize it would be unpleasant for the execution team to go there (who wants to touch another man's ball sack), but it would work.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 23, 2009 13:44:46 GMT -6
Actually, they should have gone straight to the saphenous vein in the scumbags ankle... Two minutes tops, and the only discomfort he would feel is the local anesthetic injection(s)... I read yesterday on MSN that they did try to tap a vein in his legs. I am not sure if that is true, but it was on the MSN homepage. I know a lot of drug users inject in the ankle. I am sure if they gave the inmate a needle loaded with heroin he would manage to find a vein. On any account, the groin the way to go. Most drug users have never injected there, and it is a huge vein area. I mean, whenever you get a boner, the blood flows pretty rapidly to the *deleted*. Surely the could stick a needle there and inject the lethal poison. I know at least one other state has done it before. I realize it would be unpleasant for the execution team to go there (who wants to touch another man's ball sack), but it would work. Ok, I'm not even going to dignify this post...
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Lady
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Post by Lady on Sept 23, 2009 20:36:00 GMT -6
Actually, they should have gone straight to the saphenous vein in the scumbags ankle... Two minutes tops, and the only discomfort he would feel is the local anesthetic injection(s)... I read yesterday on MSN that they did try to tap a vein in his legs. I am not sure if that is true, but it was on the MSN homepage. I know a lot of drug users inject in the ankle. I am sure if they gave the inmate a needle loaded with heroin he would manage to find a vein. On any account, the groin the way to go. Most drug users have never injected there, and it is a huge vein area. I mean, whenever you get a boner, the blood flows pretty rapidly to the *deleted*. Surely the could stick a needle there and inject the lethal poison. I know at least one other state has done it before. I realize it would be unpleasant for the execution team to go there (who wants to touch another man's ball sack), but it would work. I'm not a dude but all I gotta say is OUCH! edited to add the following link . www.dispatchpolitics.com/live/content/local_news/stories/2009/09/23/copy/z-apoh_deathpenalty1_0923.ART_ART_09-23-09_B4_40F5L7K.html?adsec=politics&sid=101Delay in federal court Nov. 30 hearing set for second try to execute inmate Wednesday, September 23, 2009 3:05 AM By Andrew Welsh-Huggins ASSOCIATED PRESS <p>Executioners who tried to lethally inject Romell Brown on Sept. 15 said they couldn't find a usable vein.</p> Executioners who tried to lethally inject Romell Brown on Sept. 15 said they couldn't find a usable vein. A federal judge in Columbus yesterday further delayed a second attempt to put a condemned rapist and killer to death by lethal injection. U.S. District Judge Gregory Frost's order, which pushes a hearing on the fate of inmate Romell Broom from next week to Nov. 30, was unopposed by the state. It gives the state and Broom's attorneys time to gather more information to argue over trying to execute Broom again for the 1984 rape and murder of a teenage girl he abducted at knifepoint in Cleveland. Gov. Ted Strickland stopped Broom's Sept. 15 execution after about two hours when executioners failed to find a usable vein. No Ohio governor has issued a similar last-minute reprieve since the state resumed executions in 1999. Broom, who said he was stuck with needles as many as 18 times, was seen weeping during the procedure and later complained of painful needle sticks into his bone and muscles. During the execution attempt, he even tried to help the executioners secure his death. He turned over on his left side, slid rubber tubing designed to clarify his veins up his left arm, then began moving the arm up and down while flexing and closing and opening his fingers. The execution team was able to access a vein, but it collapsed when technicians tried to insert saline fluid. Broom then became visibly distressed, turning over on his back and covering his face with his hands while crying. His attorneys have sued in state and federal courts to prevent a second execution attempt, saying it would be cruel and unusual punishment. Executioners said they couldn't find a usable vein because Broom had used intravenous drugs in the past. But Broom's brother questioned the allegation of intravenous drug use. "He did not do drugs," Randall Broom said yesterday. "I know he smoked a little marijuana. But the hard drugs, no." He said the state shouldn't get a second chance to execute his brother. "It's like double jeopardy," he said. "They couldn't do it. So why should they do it again? They should have did it the first time." Romell Broom, 53, was sentenced to die for the rape and stabbing death of 14-year-old Tryna Middleton. Cuyahoga County prosecutor Bill Mason has called Broom's allegations about cruel and unusual punishment ironic given the nature of his crime. "I am absolutely certain," Mason said last week, "that it was Tryna Middleton that suffered from cruel and unusual punishment." Strickland's decision to stop the execution and grant a one-week reprieve appeared to be unprecedented since capital punishment was declared constitutional and the nation resumed executions in the 1970s. Inmates in several states have experienced delays with the injection of lethal chemicals, but those executions always proceeded the same day.
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Post by Matt on Sept 23, 2009 21:18:23 GMT -6
Broom then became visibly distressed, turning over on his back and covering his face with his hands while crying. I'm calling bs on this. His arms and hands would have been secured to the gurney by this time.
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mst3k4evur
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Post by mst3k4evur on Sept 23, 2009 23:48:06 GMT -6
Broom then became visibly distressed, turning over on his back and covering his face with his hands while crying. I'm calling bs on this. His arms and hands would have been secured to the gurney by this time. I believe they tried to put the IV shunts into his arm before bringing him into the chamber and strapping him to the gurney.
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Post by Rev. Agave on Sept 24, 2009 9:36:38 GMT -6
I read yesterday on MSN that they did try to tap a vein in his legs. I am not sure if that is true, but it was on the MSN homepage. I know a lot of drug users inject in the ankle. I am sure if they gave the inmate a needle loaded with heroin he would manage to find a vein. On any account, the groin the way to go. Most drug users have never injected there, and it is a huge vein area. I mean, whenever you get a boner, the blood flows pretty rapidly to the *deleted*. Surely the could stick a needle there and inject the lethal poison. I know at least one other state has done it before. I realize it would be unpleasant for the execution team to go there (who wants to touch another man's ball sack), but it would work. Ok, I'm not even going to dignify this post... You just did. And I am factually spot on. You might not like the way I express it, but I like to get straight to the point. Nothing I said is untrue, and if they would have went for the groin, this a$$hole would be dead.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 24, 2009 12:52:28 GMT -6
Ok, I'm not even going to dignify this post... You just did. And I am factually spot on. No I didn't, and no you're not...
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mst3k4evur
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Post by mst3k4evur on Sept 24, 2009 13:19:56 GMT -6
You just did. And I am factually spot on. No I didn't, and no you're not... You dignified it with a response.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Sept 24, 2009 13:29:55 GMT -6
No I didn't, and no you're not... You dignified it with a response. Yeah, and you're brilliant.
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Post by Rev. Agave on Sept 24, 2009 18:27:23 GMT -6
You just did. And I am factually spot on. No I didn't, and no you're not... Ok, why don't you correct me and tell me why I am wrong in my assertion that the groin area contains a huge vein than can (and has) been used to deliver a lethal injection. Please, I want to know this stuff. How can I change my post to make it factually accurate?
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